Press Release
October 18, 2012

Transcript of Kapihan sa Senado with Sen. Gringo Honasan

On the Framework Agreement between the government and MILF Siguro naman, kahit si Chairman Misuari, tatanggapin niya na let us give peace a chance. Sana noise lang ito dahil matagal na itong pinaghirapan ng government peace panel, Islamic revolutionary groups at hindi lang naman ito pakikinabangan ng mga kababayan natin sa Mindanao. Nandiyan naman ang framework. Work in progress ito at doon mismo sa Framework Agreement ay sinabi naman ni Professor Leonen at Secretary Deles na marami pang detalye ang magbibigay substansiya dito. This is a long term process. The ultimate objectives: unity, lasting peace, economic development and economic prosperity. Alam ito ni Chairman Misuari kaya nagpaparamdam lang siguro si Chairman.

I guess the message, and I welcome this as a positive development, panonoorin nila 'yung mangyayari sa peace process katulad noong nanonood din naman ang MILF noong 'yung MNLF naman ang nakikipag-kasunduan. Mag-oobserba sila, kung dahan-dahan magtagumpay, then saka sila magpapaloob at lalahok dito.

Dapat with or without the peace process, whoever you are, whatever group you are, you violate the law, you violate the Constitution, you will be faced by the Armed Forces of the Philippines and the Philippine National Police who are tasked to enforce the law and enforce the Constitution.

Actually, 'yung paghahanap ng hustisya ay hindi pag-aaari ng kasundaluhan lamang, kapulisan o 'yung mga rebeldeng grupo na lumahok sa armadong tunggalian for the last 40 years. Papaano naman 'yung mga civilian who are the ultimate beneficiaries and the historical victims of this armed conflict and deeper forms of violence? So, pangkalahatan ito. Hindi ito peculiar to a particular sector or group.

Hindi pa ito successful. 'Yung pinagdaanan ay 'yung easy part. The harder part, as the President described, will probably bear fruit on or before the end of his term in 2016. So, malayo pa 'yung landas na tatahakin natin bago natin makita 'yung bunga ng Framework Peace Agreement na ito.

Walang nagsabi na madali ito, na makakamit ito overnight. Kailangan talaga 'yung political will hindi lang sa panig ng pamahalaan kung di sa panig ng buong sambayanang Pilipino. Kailangan mag-develop tayo ng tinatawag na "peace constituency" para lahat involved, 'yung lahat ng sector ay makiki-isa at ipaglalaban 'yung kapayapaan. Napakahirap ito sa armadong tunggalian. Ang naaapektuhan ay 'yung mga innocent civilians.

To make it work, is a challenge not only for Chairman Misuari and the panels who have agreed on this Framework for Peace but for the entire citizenry especially in Mindanao which might be a good blueprint for other rebel groups including the naudlot na peace process with the CPP-NPA-NDF.

Ang tunay na kalaban natin, hindi naman 'yung mga rebeldeng grupo o 'yung isa't-isa. Ang tunay na kalaban natin ay kahirapan, kawalan ng hustisya, pabahay, medical services --- the basics. 'Yun ang tunay na kalaban where we must continue to fight and win in the hearts and minds of our people.

A starting point must be marked by mutual trust and confidence. Kung ang starting point ay pagdududa, suspicion, distrust, that would not be a reasonable starting point. Kaya nga tinawag na Peace Framework. For the first time, let's deal with each other with sincerity at patutunayan natin 'yon.

Kapag wala ka ng armas, you are left defenseless. 'Yan ang pananaw ng ibang rebel groups. Pero mayroong successful experiment na diyan. Kung maaalala natin 'yung MNLF, mayroon na silang two battalions of integrees securing the Zamboanga peninsula. Alam ito ng MILF. Masalimuot 'yan. Naalala ko, more than one decade ago, ang analysis ng mga sumusubaybay dito, kung malakas ka sa armas, malakas ang pwersa mo, bakit ka makikipag-usap? Kung mahina ka, makikipag-usap ka to buy time, to consolidate. That's the pragmatic view pero in this case, kailangan seryosohin natin 'yung pinakitang sinseridad ng ating Pangulo. Siya mismo ang pumunta sa Tokyo para makipag-usap sa mga leaders ng MILF. Never has that been done in the history of the peace process although noong panahon ni FVR, mayroon siyang magaling na peace negotiator, the late Chairman Heidi Yorac. Kahit matapos na ang termino ni Pangulong Noynoy Aquino, dapat matatag pa rin ang climate and environment of peace.

May mga komentaryo na nagpapakita ng kawalang kumpiyansa, 'yung mga nanonood na hawak 'yung armas nila. Pero ito naman ang threshold. May armas ka, hindi ka pumasok sa peace process, wag kang kukubli sa peace process. If you violate the law, ang katapat mo hindi peace negotiator, legally authorized armed groups --- AFP and PNP, in coordination with the local government units. Kailangan maintindihan 'yan ng mga splinter group, breakaway group na from the history of the peace process, laging sumusulpot tuwing may magandang balita. The question is sino ba ang nakikinabang sa giyera? Nagbebenta ng baril, 'yung mga may limited political agenda. Ito ang mga sangkap ng total environment under which the peace process must operate. These are the challenges that we must face head on.

Whatever benefits we give to the rebel groups, kasama 'yan sa detalye ng Peace Agreement pero pag-ingatan natin na wag magreklamo 'yung hindi humawak ng armas.

Kung gusto nating gawin, may paraan. Kung ayaw nating gawin, may dahilan. Kung papaubaya natin ito sa mga Constitutionalists, di limitado. Tanungin natin 'yung mga nawalan ng ama, ng family members. Tanungin natin 'yung mga abogado at Constitutionalists pero huwag natin itong gawing problema. Ngayon, kung 'yung Framework, sa pagsusuri natin ay labag sa Constitution, 'yung form of government natin, then i-presenta natin sa taong-bayan.

On Bangsa Moro peace process

May successful experiment tayo dito. May two battalions of MNLF integrees, kasama na sila sa AFP or PNP chain of command. National Security, central government yan, pero local government, local police yan, then supervision and control lang 'yan. It's almost procedural. But we have only one legal authorized armed group, AFP or PNP combined. Any other group na may armas, illegal yan, unconstitutional yan. Actually, symbolic lang yan pagbaba armas. Pagbaba ka na armas, you will be sworn in as members of the Armed Forces or the Police Forces, then you are issued firearms. So, hindi na issue 'yung kung pumasok ka ba sa enclave or Bansang Moro territory. Pag pumasok doon ang dating fighters ng MILF, actually ang pasok nila doon hindi na as Bangsa Moro fighters but as AFP and PNP. So, there is constitutional and legal backing for their new identity.

On freedom of religion

It's in the Constitution, the freedom of religion. Pero pinagpipilitan ng iba, that this is a religious issue. It is not. It is a social and economic issue. It is a development issue but it is not a religious issue. Ang pumipilit lang na religious issue ito ay 'yung nakikinabang dito, para hindi matapos 'yung guerra kasi nakikinabang sila sa guerra. Alam naman ang sambayan kung sino mga yan. Gusto natin national government na predictable. Kahit sino ang governor, sino ang presidente, tuloy ang programa. Hindi 'yung new President, new governor, new council, new program. Kaya tayo lagi back to zero. May element ngayon ng predictability. 'Yung mga foreign or local investors gustong sila tumulong kasi matagalan. Hindi 'yung tataya kami pero pull out kaagad pag kumita na dahil hindi tayo alam ano mangyayari pag bago na 'yung gubernador or presidente.

On whether Bangsa Moro's budget will be subjected to audit

Subject pa rin sa audit dahil national budget 'yan pero siyempre mag sa-submit pa sila reports sa COA. So, governed pa rin by our national laws and the Constitution. Hindi ito bagong formula, dating formula pa ito at sa tingin ko ma-i-implement religiously ngayon.

On whether other armed groups will demand the same political entity

Siyempre panibagong negotiation 'yan kasi iba ang ideological, political economic at social content. Ang tinutulak ever since 'yung Bangsa Moro is a separate state. Hindi pwede 'yon. Anong tutulak ang mga ibang grupo dito sa peace process? Dapat malinaw 'yun. Kung power sharing, nandyan naman sa framework, pero kung sasabihin kayo ang magte-takeover, malabo 'yun. Hindi pwede 'yun mayroon kayong parliamentary, mayroon din kayo armado.

On assurance that Bangsa Moro will not be a failed experiment like ARMM

No assurance. From failed experiment, we learn. I believe, deep in my heart, that the present framework, which I read, is a better experiment. Let us help the experiment succeed.

On amnesty of rebels

Amnesty is an act of forgetfulness. Kakalimutan na natin, hindi para sa rebelde lamang pero para sa lahat. One new page. New chapter. Pero 'yung kausap natin sa iba't ibang sector, huwag natin isacrifice 'yung hustisya. Pag may ebidensya na, nasa korte na, ituloy. Pero, 'yong alam natin na pulitika lang ang pinanggalingan, ibaon na natin ito dahil ito 'yong mabigat na bagahe na nagpipigil sa atin na tumakbo ng mabilis. It is retarding our development. I believe that this is the cumulative effect of years, decades of lack of vision and mismanagement. And now, with so much democratic space, a new leader who is bent on pushing for reforms, then this is another opportunity for us.

On Al-Barka case

Pag may pinatay, may nasaktan, may ari-arian nasira, 'yan ay hindi violation of peace process, violation 'yan ng Constitution at ang batas at kailangan managot ka.

On possible conspiracy between MILF And MNLF

Give them livelihood so they will find it more profitable to engage in peaceful livelihood than to coddle terrorists and rebels. Yan nag di-detalye sa peace process. Hindi porke kamag-anak kita, proprotektahan kita. May batas.

On decriminalization of libel

Hindi ako kumukubli. Pumirma ako doon dahil I was on the receiving end. Nasubok ko yung lalaitin ka ng walang kalaban laban. With every right and freedom comes a corresponding responsibility. Whether its cybercrime or the sin tax, pag pumirma ka sa committee report ang ibig sabihin nun ay hindi yung ipasa na natin ito. Kaya nga naglalagay kami ng with reservations. Ang ibig sabihin ng pirma ng miyembero ng committee ay simulan na ang debate. Sa tingin ko, hindi nila mabatikos yung pangulo dahil ang taas ng trust rating. Yung sin tax, committee report pa lang, umani na ng batikos. Yung kawawa ay yung chairman ng committee ng ways and means. Pero ang pinoprotektahan ng mga senador at ni Senate President ay yung proseso. Ang proseso ayon sa batas ay hearing, konsultasyon, technical working group and then i-pe-plenary. Pag plenary, debate, amendment, interpellation and bicameral conference committee. Ang tagal bago siya mapirmahan. So nagkapaliwanagan kahapon. All is well that ends well. Yung mga mas developed na countries, umaamin na hirap na hirap silang i-enforce yung cyber regulation laws nila. Bakit? This is unchartered territory. Sa Lunes, maghi-hearing tayo. Decriminalization of libel not only for journalist but for the entire citizenry. Baka mahagip dyan yung right to reply. Hindi naman pwedeng batikusin ka. Kelangan may paraan ka rin para sumagot punto por punto.

On President Aquino's change of stand on the cybercrime bill

Hindi ito pagbibigay. Pagbibigay ito sa mga naghain sa Korte Suprema. Nakinig ang Korte Suprema. 120 days ang TRO. Ang dami pang nakaumang na amendments. Ibig sabihin ako, happy ako dyan dahil nasusunod yung proseso. Walang mga premature nag alit at batikos. Sabi ng halos walo sa sampung Pilipino,: "Nagtitiwala kami sa pangulo." Sagutin yan yung mga nagbabatikos na bumigay yung pangulo. Siguro hindi nila mabatikos yung ating pangulo sa taas ng trust rating, naghanap sila ng target sa baba.

On the caucus that happened yesterday

Sa ngayon, for the sin tax is Senator Frank Drilon. He is now the acting chairman. Kung mag-act si Sen. Drilon na ang gamiting basehan sa debate is yung committee report ni Sen. Recto, pano naman niya interpellate yung sarili niyang report. Magdedecide ngayon si Sen. Frank kung back to zero or starting point is yung committee report ni Sen. Recto. Kung may issues at kailangan iresolve, isubmit sa plenary. Hindi ko alam kasi Sen. Frank will tell the chamber what he will do with the report.

On the sin tax issue

Para sa akin, mas important yung substance nung discussion. Ito balancing of interest. Ano yung original proposal from the House? 60 billion. Yung final House version is 31 billion. Yung Recto report is 15 billion. Ano gusto natin? Hell dun sa mga nanigarilyo na nagkasakit o yung manginginom na hindi alam kung kelan titigil or yung tobacco farmers. Hindi ito simpleng health or revenue issue. Meron ditong public order issue kaya interesado ako dito. Pag umakyat ang smuggling, magbabanggaan ba in the streets or in our coastline yung smugglers at yung kapulisan. After taking all of this into consideration, we must decide. Sa Senate, we must decide in plenary kung ano ang direction nito. Decisions. Hindi ko sinasabing ito ang tama, ito ang mali. Yun ang magiging contribution ko sa debate at sa diskusyon. Kung ma-bring up ito ng ibang senador na aminado ko naman, mas magagaling, then tatahimik ako. Basta't na-address yung point na yun.

Q Wala bang naging kasunduan na ibaba sa P40 billion yung targets?

Decision ni Senator Frank. May mga compromise proposals pero nothing was decided on, because Senator Drilon had to leave for the IPU. Pero, nagka-hingahan ng hindi naman sama ng loob, nagka-linawan.

Q Nagka-hingahan ng sama ng loob?

Yun nga ang perception ko. Buti hindi na namin tinake-up yung China. Sabi ng magkabilang panig, ito daw yung sinabi ko according to media. Hindi ninyo kasalanan, ha? Pero ang ibig kong sabihin talaga ay ito. Ganoon.

Q So naging scapegoat tuloy ang media? Sino po ang nagsabi?

Hindi. Hindi ko na maalala.

Q Kung gagamitin ninyo po yung Recto or not, saan po kayo doon?

Ako, back to zero.

Q So, Committee Hearing again sir?

Hindi naman. Pag sinabing Recto Report, en toto. Pero kung sabing kunin natin itong provision na ito, walang nagpipigil sa Chairman. In short, diskarte niya yan. Nagkasundo kami na ipaubaya kay Senator Frank, dahil nga irrevocable yung resignation ni Senator Ralph, di ba? So pwede siya kumuha dito, magtanong ulit. Better careful than sorry. Kung i-rush na naman natin ito dahil may deadline, malaki ang problema natin. Meron na namang aalma diyan, baka maging cyber-crime ito. Hindi na natin na-meet yung deadline.

Q May mga proposal na i-adopt na lang let's say yung Bill ni Senator Miriam?

Pero these are all proposals on the table. We will wait for Senator Frank to report to the Chamber what has been agreed on by the Committee. Pag may differences in opinion, sinabing hindi namin kaya ito i-resolve sa Committee, Plenary.

Q Sabi ni Secretary Abad it does not matter whether forty or sixty percent?

Well, Secretary Abad, if he is not worried, cool. Very good.

Q Buti nagkaroon ng clashes between government officials?

But, the power of the purse belongs to Congress according to our Constitution. If Secretary Abad can make statements and reassure us, very good. But it is Congress who will decide.

Q Sa caucus ba yesterday, nakumbinse si Senate President Enrile sa explanation ni Secretary Mamba doon sa issue ng lobby money?

It was not a meeting to convince. It was a meeting to put on the table our perceptions. Our inputs. Walang sinabing ito ang gusto kong mangyari, pagbotohan natin. Hindi. Ito ang thinking ko, ito ang paliwanag ko, ito ang explanation ko. Kaya maganda yung kinalabasan. Mapapansin ninyo, may proposal pa nga na joint press conference, but after resolving it, I think it was redundant. Nagka-intindihan na.

Q What do you think sa sinabi ng Department of Finance? Win-win solution ba na hindi na P60 billion yung target? Binaba nila sa P40 billion?

It is not about the solution anymore. It is about mutual respect. Congress makes the laws, the power of the purse. The Executive branch implements. Kung may suggestion kayo, sabihin ninyo pero wag ninyo kaming pangunahan. Kung sabihin ninyo kayo ang majority, gusto naming itulak ito, magkasundo tayo. Wag naman yung okay na yan, pagsalita namin may Committee Report, sasabihin ninyo hindi kami payag d'yan. Para ano pa tayo nag-usap? Kaya nga may Committee hearing. Kaya nga may LEDAC. Kaya nga may technical working group. So mutual respect. At mapansin ninyo, the President is above this. Hindi siya nakikialam dito. In other words, this is a natural aspect of democracy kaya very dynamic. Ma-antala yan, ma-Supreme Court, ma-TRO, basta't sundin ninyo yung proseso. Tsaka hangga't maaari, wag mag-init ang ulo natin dahil hindi ba nagsa-sara yung mga position kapag nagka-insultuhan publicly? Kaya nga may caucus. Para walang camera. Hindi tayo magkaka-hiyaan. Sabihin mo yung niloloob mo, wag ka mag-alala, hindi ka lalabas sa six o'clock news.

Q What is the chance na ma-achieve pa rin yung target na mid of November, ma-approve yung sin tax bill?

Hindi ko masasagot yan. Pag sinabing ipasa natin ito at all cost, then we have to decide. I am one of twenty-three and I am a very quiet one of twenty-three.

ON PDEA

Q You conducted an investigation doon sa PDEA controversy but now that the President appointed a new PDEA chief, ano ang implication noon?

It is beyond personalities. We will find out if the new PDEA chief will respond to what is written in the law. Beyond personalities. Yung mga insinuations that were made public, that was totally unnecessary. Ang interest ng Kongreso, ng Senado, ng Senate Committee on Public Order and Dangerous Drugs is, nasusunod ba yung batas? Bakit ang daming violations sa Dangerous Drugs Act? Pati itong mga sinasabing, ang dami namang patayan, riding in tandem. I cannot naman pre-empt the police. Hirap na hirap na nga sa trabaho, tapos sasabihin ko pa na ano ba naman? So I will wait for a report. If the report is different from what I am getting on the ground, then I will say, bakit magkaiba? Then I will decide to conduct a hearing and get the permission of the Chamber.

Q During Martial Law, talagang talamak yung involuntary disappearance. Now there is a law na crime na po yun.

The easy part was passing the law. The harder part, and the challenge is in enforcing it so that human rights, our liberties, can be preserved. Ito naman, pag sinabing involuntary disappearance, hindi lang naman AFP ang guilty d'yan, di ba? Lahat culpable, kaya everything operates legally, illegally, under a cover of some motherhood principle. The challenge before all of us is to distinguish kung ano yung personal at yung pang public interest.

Q Kung sakaling maipasa yung batas na yun, at present dispensation, enforceable ba?

Malalaman natin.

Q Based on your experience?

Kaya. Kaya, pero kailangan malinaw ha? Ibig sabihin, kung gusto nating i-pursue, ang dami nating exceptions, wala rin. That is my own personal experience. In short, let us look at the law, enforce it, and pool our resources together, cooperate. One case in point, intelligence information. Hindi naman pwedeng kunin ito ng pulis lang, di ba? Bawat barangay, alam mo yung ugali natin na pagka-tsismoso natin? Alam natin kung sino yung lasenggo, yung tambay, yung walang trabaho, yung nambubugbog ng bata o matanda, alam natin yan. Kung ma-organize natin ito tapos ibigay natin sa pulis, ang dali-dali nung database.

Q So yung Committee Report na sinubmit na sa Plenary sir, tututukan mo ba siya?

Oo. Obligado ako dahil may implication sa public order.

Q Supportive kayo doon Sir?

Yes.

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