Interview with Sen. Francis G. Escudero (FGE)

DAVILA: Senator Chiz Escudero is with us this morning. Welcome to 'Hot Copy' Senator Chiz.

FGE: Karen good morning. Good morning sa ating televiewers.

DAVILA: How long did it take you to decide to quit, two very powerful chairmanships in the Senate. One being the budget, Finance. And the other one, what's the other one?

FGE: The Joint Congressional Oversight Committee.

DAVILA: Yes, oo. Wherein?

FGE: Still handling the budget implementation.

DAVILA: What made you decide to do that?

FGE: Noong recess pa pinag-iisipan ko nay un at pinag-aaralan ko na yan Karen, hindi ko lang magagawa dahil recess. Walang pagkakataon iyon at para maging opisyal sa plenaryo. Pero nabuo yung kaisipan at desisyon ko noong pinakinggan ko rin yung mahabang speech ni Pangulong Aquino. Nung sinabi niya yung dalawang bagay na tumatak sa akin kaugnay ng desisyon na ito. Una, gusto niyang magpatuloy beyond 2016 or even during 2016 yung Tuwid na Daan. Pangalawa, yung pagsasabi niyang sana sa huling pagkakataon, dahil buong taon ng kanyang termino, buong limang taon ng kanyang termino, pumapasa yung budget on time, mangyari din iyon sa huling pagkakataon naman. Ayokong maging dahilan ako Karen, dahil may galit sa akin, dahil may gustong manira sa akin, alam naman nating lalabas palagi yung pangit na mukha ng pulitika tuwing eleksiyon sa Pilipinas. Ayokong maging collateral damage yung budget.

DAVILA: That's interesting. Now do you see there's a conflict of interest as well? Because you said delicadeza.

FGE: It's a conflict of interest Karen because whether I use it or not, it will always be thrown at me and at the budget. Yung sa akin okay na iyon, dahil kung saka-sakali man na ako'y magpapasyang tumakbo, kasama na nga iyon sa masamang mukha ng pulitika sa Pilipinas. Pero yung budget madadamay mismo, pagduduhan at tatawagin ng kung ano-ano'ng pangalan, hindi siguro katanggap-tanggap iyon. Para kanino? Lalo na siguro sa akin na dating chairman.

DAVILA: How serious are you to running as VP for 2016? And what percentage are you in out of a hundred percent?

FGE: Walang 99 o 90% Karen, as long as it's not 100% hindi pa rin yun. Whether it's 80 or 90, 70 or 60, as long as it's not 100% it's all the same to me. There's still no final decision. But serious enough to resign as chairman of one of my, actually my favorite committee in the Senate, dahil marami akong natututunan bilang chairman ng Finance Committee, I learn a lot of statistics, you know exactly what's going on the ground. You know whether or not an agency is doing its functions or not. You know exactly how much is this or that. Kunwari magkano ba ang isang kilometro ng kalye, magkano ba ang isang school building. Marami kang matututunan bilang chairman ng Committee on Finance sa Senado o sa Kamara man.

DAVILA: Oo, but are you preparing?

FGE: Preparing for what?

DAVILA: Is it safe to say are you preparing? Because you do have LP, that has a machinery. Then you do have UNA coalition which has a big ground level machinery. Is someone like you who is independent, if you're quitting to major committees, you must be preparing.

FGE: Preparing more Karen internally, yes number one. Meaning malaking desisyon ito. May nagsabi nga dati, willing ka bang mag-sacrifice at huwag kang tumakbo? Sa totoo lang Karen mas malaking sakripisyo Karen yung pagtakbo kaysa hindi pagtakbo.

DAVILA: Who asked you that, are you willing to sacrifice and not run?

FGE: I think hindi direkta sa akin sinabi sa akin ni Secretary Aba iyon, sa isang interview niya, na kaming tatlo daw na kinausap ni Pangulong Aquino. Ang sagot ko nga, mas malaking sakripisyo yata yung pagtakbo kaysa hindi pagtakbo. Kasi kapag hindi ka tumakbo papitik-pitik ka lang. Pero kapag tumakbo ka, mabigat na trabaho iyon. Masama nga palagi yung mukha ng pulitika sa kampanyahan, kaya magiging personal karamihan ang mga isyu.

DAVILA: Okay. Now let's talk about what people in the street are talking about. Businessmen, politicians and they seem to have this idea that if Chiz Escudero is not there, papayag si Grace mag-VP ni Mar. I mean, let's be honest with that. That's the common perception. First, is it even true?

FGE: No, because Karen they are underestimating Grace to begin with. Let me answer in that manner first. Na tingin nila magdedesisyon si Grace base sa pagkakaibigan o relasyon lang, o base sa personal na relasyon. I think they are underestimating her to a large extent. May sarili at personal na paninindigan si Sen. Poe, na ni nanay niya siguro hindi kayang baliin o diktahan. Pangalawa, nasabi ko na ilang ulit na, sasabihin ko ulit. Nakahanda ako at susuporta ako sa anumang desisyon ni Sen. Poe. Tumakbo man siya bilang pangulo, bilang ikalawang pangulo o mag-decide man siyang hindi tumakbo. Gagawin ko iyong bilang kandidato, bilang ordinaryong supporter o bilang ordinaryong botante.

DAVILA: But you are good friends. People underestimate also how close you and Grace are frankly. If Grace, this is a direct question I want you to answer from the heart, if some weird thing happened and Grace said I want to run for VP, would a Chiz Escudero compete against her? Would you run against her?

FGE: No. As I said Karen, I will support whatever decision she arrives at. Whether to run for president, for vice president or if she decides not to run. Either as a candidate on my part, or as a supporter or voter on my part.

DAVILA: Because what many people don't see is that both of you will never run against each other.

FGE: Not because we're choosing who to run first, or who will run next. Hindi ako naniniwala sa sinisindikato yung eleksiyon Karen na, mag-uusap tayo, o ikaw ngayon next year ako naman, next year siya naman. Hindi namin desisyon iyon, desisyon yun dapat ng taumbayan, hindi kami. Pwede naming ialay yung sarili namin pero hindi namin pwedeng pagkasunduan kung sino ang sequence ng tatakbo. Hindi namin desisyon yon.

DAVILA: Now, if Grace decides not to run for any post. Is your running for vice president, does it depend on Grace running or not? Would you run alone, hypothetically?

FGE: If Grace decides, for example, hypothetically if Grace decides not to run then I will have to decide on my own, what to do. Whether to run or not. But as I have said previously, tutulong ako at susuporta muna ako sa anumang desisyon niya. Tulad din ng ginawa ko sa tatay niya noon. At pagkatapos noon, dun naman ako magpapasya kaugnay ng sarili ko.

DAVILA: Okay. Now, you are not scared of funding? Both of you? Do you have people coming to you and wanting to support you?

FGE: Lahat ng eleksyon ko Karen wala akong pera para patakbuhin yung eleksiyon ko.

DAVILA: Pero president at bise 'to ah. Hindi rin siya biro.

FGE: Congressman o senador Karen naniniwala ako, I've always worked on two assumptions. Una, hindi mo naman kailangan hawak, dahil kung hawak mo iyon, napakaraming pwedeng ibato sayong issue para hindi ka rin manalo. What's the purpose? Number two, naniniwala rin ako na gagastusin ko lang naman kung ano yung meron ako. I've been like that in all of my campaigns, whether for Congress or senator. Kung ano yung dumating, yun lang.

DAVILA: But you should also say you'll return excess funds.

FGE: I declared, I did.

DAVILA: Yeah, you did. I know it for a fact that you did. P40 million in funds.

FGE: I also declare yung excess na hindi binabalik. Dahil again, we make do with what we have.

DAVILA: Now, former President Estrada said that when he was here, parang medyo masama loob niya sa iyo. Maybe this is a good time. He said my relationship with Chiz is so-so. Kasi daw when he approached you in 2010, you said president or nothing. I want to hear your side of the story.

FGE: That's not true Karen, that even came out in a book somewhere. That's not true, hindi ko sinagot iyon. Hindi ko bibigyan ng kawalan ng paggalang si dating Pangulong Estrada sa pagbigay ng ganyang uri ng sagot. Naalala ko yang conversation na yan, sa bahay niya at sa opisina. At ang sabi ko hindi pa ako tiyak at sigurado sa tatakbuhan ko o pagtakbo ko. At hindi iyon ang konteksto ng pag-uusap namin. Dahil noong panahon na iyon kung maaalala mo Karen, naendorso na kami unofficially ni Sen. Legarda bilang kandidato ng NPC, bagama't wala pa akong pormal na desisyon ng mga panahong iyon.

DAVILA: So what did you tell him? Do you remember the exact words you told Erap?

FGE: Na wala pa akong pasya at desisyon, yung konteksto na in-endorso ako ng NPC bilang...

DAVILA: You told him that?

FGE: Yes. Gayundin si Senator Legarda. At wala pa akong pasya o desisyon kung tatakbo ako o hindi. Hindi naman yung ganun kabargas.

DAVILA: Oo, parang bargas kasi na presidency or nothing.

FGE: Hindi ganun yung konteksto Karen, hindi ko rin ugali yon.

DAVILA: But it's safe to say of course that well, as history would prove it, you declined.

FGE: I did not declare Karen.

DAVILA: No. You declined him, Erap, twice he said.

FGE: Hindi twice. Once lang kami nag-usap nun panahong iyon. Hindi naman sa declined. As I have said nga, I have not yet decided yet. For example Karen, kahit si Pangulong Aquino kung naging prangka man siya pag-uusap namin na pwede ba ganito, pwede ba ganyan? Ang isasagot ko pa rin naman, wala akong ibibigay dahil wala pa naman akong napagpasyahan gawin. There's nothing for me to give up because I haven't decided yet on what to do, with finality. So yung deadline niyang July 31 self-imposed iyon. Hindi naman porke't iyon ang deadline niya, deadline na naming lahat yun. Deadline niya yon, hindi naman namin kailangan at hindi rin naman kailangan sundin ang deadline niya na iyon.

DAVILA: Wait, ang deadline ni President Aquino sa inyo ni Sen. Grace ay July 31?

FGE: No, ang deadline niya sa sarili niya sa July 31. Hindi ba sabi niya, kailangan kong mag-announce. That was a self-imposed deadline. It does not necessarily, for example, bind me to decide also at mag-cram ka, July 31. Hindi, may kanya-kanya tayong panahon ng pagdedesisyon. Siya meron, ako rin meron.

DAVILA: Are you willing to meet Erap? I mean let's face it. Erap right now when I spoke with him said that he is really thinking of where his endorsement or support will go. Either Binay or Grace Poe, meaning it would be your team. Your tandem, would you want to meet with him again?

FGE: Of course. Yes Yes, I will Karen. And in fact nagkita naman kami sa ilang social functions, at nabanggit ko ngang bibisitahin ko siya. At tumango naman siya .

DAVILA: I see. Now do you regret supporting and endorsing Vice President Binay in 2010. The truth.

FGE: Knowing what I knew then, no Karen. Knowing what I know now but then again hindsight is always 20/20, wala ka nang magagawa nun. Marami nga akong nababasa minsan yan ang palaging batikos, Karen. Sinuportahan daw niyan si Binay, babalik ko bakit, si Secretary Roxas, si Pangulong Aquino sinuportahan din naman si GMA noon, nung nalaman nila na may ginawa at nagawa ni GMA, bumitiw at kumalas sila sa pagbibigay ng suporta sa kanya. Walang masama doon tama lang naman yun nung nalaman nila, ngayon bago lumabas ang mga testigo laban kay Vice President Binay bago nagsalita si Vice Mayor Mercado lahat naman ng naririnig natin puro alingasngas at chismis lamang at sabay sabay nating nalaman yung mga rebelasyong lumabas sa Senado at ganon din yung findings ng AMLC at ng Court of Appeals lahat naman tayo sabay din natin narinig yun .

DAVILA: So, do you believe the accusations against Binay?

FGE: At the very least Karen, that there is sufficient basis because otherwise AMLC or the CA would not have issued such an order. Dagdag pa dun I signed the committee report recommending the filing of charges against him in compliance also so what he has been requesting for the longest time which is, to give him a day in court. Yun yung binagay namin sa kanya sa Senado nuong nirecommendahan siyang sampahan ng kaso.

DAVILA: Knowing what you know now ANC is following it up. Do you then regret supporting Binay, knowing what you know now?

FGE: Karen, I don't regret anything I've done simply because I did not know those things at that time.

DAVILA: Yeah, today.

FGE: Hindsight nga is always 20/20. You could not have seen or I could have not seen know them very much like any other person who supported the candidate in previous selections until after the fact. Again, I do not regret it's not my habbit to regret the things that I've done. I learn from it. I pick up from it. But I do not regret it. DAVILA: Do you wish do you endorse Mar Roxas instead?

FGE: (laughs).

DAVILA: The cameramen are laughing. Just answer the question.

FGE: Tignan mo pati sila tumatawa oh. Again I don't regret. I can't say anything about the past, I just learned from it.

DAVILA: In your meetings with the President Aquino, I am curious, it's you, Sen. Grace, was Mar ever in the room? How awkward is that?

FGE: Yes. Dun sa matagal na meeting. Dun sa matagal naming meeting na inabot ng madaling araw.

DAVILA: How many hours? Like 7 or 8?

FGE: 7 perhaps. Sec. Abad was there, Sec. Mar was there Sen. Grace, the President and myself.

DAVILA: So five of you? What is it like? Do you look at each other in the eyes?

FGE: Oo naman.

DAVILA: Have you, you know shook hands? And say "Oh ano, let's forget it na".

FGE: Ah walang ganun. Of course Karen, I've defended the budget of DILG as a chairman of Committee on Finance fot two consecutive years. I've had dealings with him both professionally and socially, and we're both very civil to each other. Not the same as before. I have to admit.

DAVILA: But can you be objective? Because one of VP Binay's accusations is P10 billion of the housing budget, the president didn't give it to HUDCC but it went to DILG. Is that true?

FGE: That's true. But two things.

DAVILA: It's true ha. You're being objective. This is Binay's severe accusations on alleged politicking using the budget.

FGE: Actually, Sen. Nancy raised that point but I answered it on the floor. Again about the DILG budget. Number one, that fund is to resettle the informal settlers along esteros. Hindi naman siya talaga pangpormal housing talaga. At number two, iyon ay dina-download sa mga LGUs dahil sila dapat ang magbayad, this is cash, naibibigay sa informal settlers para may panggalaw sila. Paglipat ng gamit etcetera. Yung pagpapatayo mismo ng bahay sa HUDDC iyon, sa housing agencies iyon. Pero iyung pagbigay ng pang-mobilize, pinapadaan sa LGUs iyon hindi DILG ang gumagawa at gumagastos nun. It has been asked to, bakit DILG?

DAVILA: O, bakit nga?

FGE: Kasi sa mahabang panahon nahirapan ang gobyerno na mag-resettle dahil ang mga protector ng mga naninirahan sa mga estero ay iyung mga local government officials mismo.

DAVILA: Totoo!

FGE: Kaya pinadaan sa DILG para may kapangyarihan sila kung saka-sakali disiplinahin at suspindihin yung mayor na hindi tatalima tat susunod sa kautusan nga National Government.

DAVILA: Yeah!

FGE: Let me add too, Karen.

DAVILA: So, you did not see anything wrong with this when you were appropriating the budget that P10 billion was going to DILG. You felt nothing..

FGE: Total budget iyon, Karen.

DAVILA: Yeah.

FGE: Total budget. Together with other collateral projects.

DAVILA: You didn't see anything malicious in it?

FGE: No, because I've seen it not worked when it was given to the housing agencies. I've seen it worked too when it was given to thelocal government units through the DILG. Again, it't not the DILG that would spend it, Karen. It will be the local governmentt units. Sila ang mga beneficiaries at sila ang mag-distrubute noon. Parang 'quid-pro-quo' para hindi naman magalit sa mayor na sumusuporta yung mga tao doon sa kanya. Nagbibigay siya ng kaunting pabuya para makalipat sila. Let me add, Karen. I don't think that's the government's business to allow all its citizen to live like that.

DAVILA: Yeah.

FGE: Hindi naman tamang iwanan mo ang mga kababayan mo na manirahan sa ilalim ng tulay. Minsan, masahol pa sa hayop na inaalagaan ng mga tao sa kanilang bakuran. Dapat talagang pilitin na ilipat sila ng pamahalaan para maging mas maganda ang kanilang kalagayan. Kasi, mabigat naman sa dibdib na makita na pinapayagan lamang ng gobyerno iyon at nagpipikit mata lamang siya roon, ang gobyerno at nagpipikit mata lamang siya 'dun.

DAVILA: Now, Teddy Locsin Jr. tweeted this: "When you announced your resignation in 2 Senate Panels", he said "that's not propriety, that's dereliction of duty as chair and co-chair for the majority at that. You were elected for your judgment."

FGE: Actually I answered that.

DAVILA: "No advantage can be taken for partisan reasons and both posts, conflict with duty is in promising to pass the General Appropriations Act regardless," Teddy Boy Locsin's tweet, your take on that.

FGE: Actually sinagot ko siya.

DAVILA: Ang galing niya. Ang galing nung kaniyang point.

FGE: Actually sinagot ko siya.

DAVILA: Dereliction of duty daw.

FGE: Mas gusto ko nang 'yung sasabihin niya sa'kin may dereliction of duty ako kesa sabihin niya sa akin na ginagamit ko 'yung puwesto ko at wala akong delicadeza. I'll take that any day of the week.

DAVILA: Oo. Tanong ko lang, if...hypothetical 'to. Here you are, let's say, if you are a vice presidential candidate and you were sitting in that panel, paano ba magagamit ng kandidato 'yun?

FGE: Again Karen, hindi lang naman para sa akin gaya ng sabi ko, para sa budget. Let's say may allocation ka para sa isang distrito, aangkinin ko ba 'yun? Aaaminin ko na hindi aangkinin 'yun sasabihin nila, kita mo nilagyan niya 'yan diyan 'eh kaya 'yan kumampi sa kanya.

DAVILA: Oh, ayon.

FGE: Kahit na wala akong kagagawan at kinalaman.

DAVILA: Oh, ayon, good point.

FGE: Ngayon oobject na 'yun ng ibang tao dahil lamang "ay nagdeklara na 'yan para sa kanya 'eh kaya 'yan nandiyan 'eh."

DAVILA: Yeah.

FGE: Unfair to the budget.

DAVILA: Or kaya binigay 'yan 'eh. Kaya may bagong daan diyan 'eh. Oo nga.

FGE: Kung may isang Cabinet Secretary na nagsabing o napapatunayan o nakikita nilang parang sumusuporta, sabihin nila "Oh kita mo? Kaya pinagtatanggol niyan 'yung budget 'eh. Again, I'd rather that anyone including former Congressman Teddy Boy Locsin say that, than say later on that I'm using my position to dispense favors that this is the height of PDAF, that I'm using the budget to gain favors from certain politicians. I wouldn't want to come to that point.

DAVILA: Oo. Okay. Another question. Erap said "I believe Chiz wants the presidency and there's nothing wrong with that." Do you still want the presidency?

FGE: I'm not even sure if I want the vice presidency at this point, Karen.

DAVILA: (Laughs)

FGE: If at all we will cross bridge and get there, I might not even reach that bridge.

DAVILA: (laughs)

FGE: Let me cross this one first.

DAVILA: Alright. We're gonna be right back with Senator Chiz Escudero. More questions, up next.

(commercial break)

DAVILA: There are a lot of questions coming in, after resigning at the Senate Finance Committee, who do you think would be best to replace you?

FGE: Kahit sino doon sa aking apat na vice chairman, Senator Osmena, Senator Recto, Senator Guingona and Senator Legarda would all be qualified. Ang pinaka-eksperyensado diyan siyempre si Senator Osmena at si Senator Recto. Pero ang hindi lamang tatakbo sa susunod na eleksiyon as a re-electionist would be Senator Legarda, re-electionist kasi si Senator Osmena, Senator Recto at Senator Guingona.

DAVILA: So parang what you believe is best it be Senator Loren, basically she's not facing any interest this coming 2016.

FGE: That's my decision Karen and I will not impose it to anyone else, that is the reason why I resigned but I will not impose that personal belief and standard on anyone else. It's the decision of the majority. I'll leave it up to the majority.

DAVILA: Now another question, why do you think it took PNoy so long to actually give instructions on the FOI Bill?

FGE: Ang pahayag yata ay nakalimutan at ang mga pahayag ng mga unang taon ng FOI that they will endorse it and have it passed before their term end. Ayon din kay Sec. Lacierda may mga Executive Orders din naman sila na nagpapatupad doon and to be fair to the president, naaalala mo pinayagan niyang i-release yung mga text messages niya in relation to the Mamasapano incident sans an FOI Bill, ang problema ko lang kapag hindi na siya ang nakaupo baka hindi naman (inaudible) yung mga EO at AO na ginawa ni Pangulong Aquino, mas maganda pa din na maisabatas na iyon.

DAVILA: Now there are memes coming out in the social media wherein the president was able to thank his hairdresser, but then didn't thank the soldiers that died and PNP officers.

FGE: That was unfortunate Karen but having said that ito na man din ang mayroong pinakamaraming pasasalamat sa maski na sinumang president. Of all the SONAs I've attended in the past 15 years, nagyon lang nagpasalamat ang pangulo sa mga tumulong sa kanya gawin ang trabaho niya, usually ang pangulo silensyo na lang doon at hindi na nagsasalita o ang parang lumalabas sila na lang ang gumawa nun at least si Pangulong Aquino nagpasalamat siya doon sa opisyal niyang pamilya na gumabay at tumulong sa kanya nitong nagdaang limang taon.

DAVILA: So what did you think of the SONA?

FGE: Mahaba.

DAVILA: Okay but do you think of the supposed achievements?

FGE: Maraming nagawa, pero marami pa sanang magagawa at nagawa, iyon ang pananaw ko sa mga binanggit niya sa SONA.

DAVILA: Do you believe the trajectory plan that if it's 6.8% in the next 10 years, there was a plan. We will be First World?

FGE : Magandang panghawakan iyon pero alam naman natin na hindi lang naman ekonomiya ng Pilipinas ang tinitignan natin, kapag bumagsak o maging negatibo o umangat ang ekonomiya ng ibang bansa buong mundo, apektado tayo palagi one way or the other. Halimbawa isang bansa na madaming OFWs biglang bumagsak at ang ekonomiya nila ay hindi masyadong maganda, marahil paalisin o pauwiin ang ilang OFWs, apektado tayo palagi.

DAVILA: The president kept on, well not naming, well some of his critics and he said kapag, kumbaga in effect, kung mayroon na tayong ipinunla dapat piliin ng mabuti ang susunod. And he focused on Binay, it was a three shot, which apparently he really instructed, he really wanted that three shot with Binay, Grace and Mar.

FGE: He instructed that Grace be in the middle and two guys on the side.

DAVILA: Yes, I don't know but did you see something with that?

FGE: No, baka hindi pinagtabi sa inset kasi baka kahit magkatabi lang sa camera ay mag-away pa so nilagyan ng referee sa gitna.

DAVILA: Do you have to be a Liberal Party appointee para ipatupad ang Daang Matuwid? That one you should explain. For example, someone like you and Grace carry on the president's Daang Matuwid. Can Binay carry it? Does it have to be Mar to carry it?

FGE: Walang partido LP man o sinuman ang may monopoliya ng magandang intensyon, talento, talino at magandang trabaho para sa bansa. In fact even the president Karen. He's the president not only of LP members but of the entire country both LP and non-LP. He is in fact the president of those who voted for him and those who did not vote for him. Those who like him and him. At the end of the day I don't think anyone person or any one party group or organization can ever hold the monopoly of good intentions for the country.

DAVILA: What happened to you and Senator Serge Osmena?

FGE: I don't know Karen.

DAVILA: He dislikes you.

FGE: I don't know Karen, I don't know why. Pero palaging mataas ang respeto ko sa kanya, I may not agree with him always but the respect has always been there in my part because he taught me a lot of things and I learned a lot of things from him too when I was beginning my term as senator and even my first campaign as a senator. Palagi ko siyang gagalangin at nandoon palagi ang galang ko. Pero hindi nangangahulugang palagi akong sasang-ayon.

DAVILA: Pero what happened to the both of you? Did you fight?

FGE: Wala kaming pinag-awayan Karen, walang debate walang argumento wala kaming pinag-awayan, kung nagugulat ka, nagugulat din ako sa nababasa ko sa dyaryo.

DAVILA: But then when you read the papers did you try to contact him? I mean he's gone as far as calling you baggage.

FGE: No Karen, again while I do respect him I do not necessarily agree with him with what he is saying or says.

DAVILA : But are you willing to meet with him because let's face it, he will run for the Senate and in case, I mean in a hypothetical situation, if you and Grace are running, the question is he may end up running with both you.

FGE: I don't know of that is a possibility Karen. Kailangan mauna muna ang desisyon ni Senator Grace sa pagtakbo. Ang ang desisyon ko sa pagtakbo. And even the decision of Senator Serge to run for re-election. Mauuna muna iyon bago ang mga coalition.

DAVILA: You don't talk to each other in the Senate?

FGE: Actually we do.

DAVILA: Howweird.

FGE: About work.

DAVILA: That's weird, you talk in the Senate and the read it in the papers.

FGE: Recess naman kami Karen so hindi kami nagkikita (laughs).

DAVILA: It's gone as far of him, accusing you of being involved at some point, of the NFA corruption wherein you appointed Lito Banayo, not appointed but recommended him.

FGE: That's not true, I did not recommend Sec. Banayo.

DAVILA: Never?

FGE: Never. But I did recommend him for another position.

DAVILA: But not for NFA?

FGE: As board I think of PCSO which he was interested at that time.

DAVILA: So you never recommended Lito Banayo for NFA? Were you ever involved in any NFA activities?

FGE: No Karen, well my father was former DA Secretary during the time of Ramos and Marcos.

DAVILA: Some people fear your ties with Bobby Ongpin, can you straighten this out, of course you got married in Balisin which is an Ongpin property. So how deep are the ties? Did it affect any decisions you make in the Senate?

FGE: Wala, kung may mga kaso man na laban sa kanya hinaharap niya at dapat niyang harapin hindi para sa akin na tumayo bilang abogado niya, korte o saanman. In fact yung mga kasong isinampang laban sa kanya nasa korte yung iba nadismiss and dismissed na at wala akong kinalaman o pakialam doon. Ang masakit dito Karen alam mo para itong criminality by association e. Porke't may kakilala ka na ganito porke't may kaibigan ka na ganito kung may ginawa man sila o alegasyon na ginawa nila, dahil walang maipukol sa iyo. Yun na din ang ibabato sa iyo, hindi naman siguro tama iyon.

DAVILA: I like that, criminality by association. Question here from ANC, if you decide to run as VP and you win, what cabinet position would you ask for?

FGE: Hindi ko alam, desisyon ng magiging pangulo iyon, posibleng wala din.

DAVILA : Posibleng wala?

FGE: Depende iyon sa pangulo and a cabinet position is the choice of the president always, it's an alter ego of the president. He or she ia an alter ego of the president.

DAVILA: You met with FVR. How was that?

FGE: Masaya, alam mo naman siya palabiro.

DAVILA: But did he promise you support?

FGE: No, we didn't asked, we just met with him so that he could share some of his thoughts, I met him earlier, we had a talk and siguro mga one month ago. Sabi niya gusto na niya i-meet si Senador Poe sabi ko, sabihin ko sa kanya. Sabi niya samahan mo na din para magkakwentuhan tayo ulit. So that was the premise of our visit to FVR.

DAVILA: Did FVR tell Senator Grace you're too young, you lack experience, wait it out.

FGE: It's quite the opposite Karen, what he said was , even on TV, that, ang sinasabi niya palagi, sabi niya sa TV noon kay Karmina ata kung hindi ako nagkakamali, where are the young people? Without saying that it's necessarily her or me. Gusto lang niya magkaron ng mas malawak na papel ang mga kabataan, alam mo Karen bilib ako sa kanya kasi may sinabi siya, alam mo tigilan na natin yung Ilokano ka, Bikolano ka, Waray ka o Cebuano ka.

DAVILA: Because at abroad it is like that.

FGE : Pero siya Karen higit pa dun. We are all human beings living on earth, kadidiskubre lang ng Pluto, pwede ba huwag na tayo magaway-away sa planeta natin? That's an even wider and broader perspective of what we should do as a race, not only as a country but as a race.

DAVILA:So willing ka na makipagbatin kay Sec. Mar?

FGE: Hindi naman kami nag-away Karen, wala kaming pagkakataon na nag-away o sigawan.

DAVILA: But then Paul Campo sent me a text and asked. He is in the housing business. He watches Headstart everyday. And he asks, why did you dump Mar in 2010 to support Binay, that is his question. What made him decide to dump Mar in 2010?

FGE: Nalilito ako sa tanong niya Karen, hindi naman ako nagsimulang supporter ni Secretary Roxas at that time. There was no one for me to dump, I was independent at that time. And like any voter namili ako ng kung sino ang susuportahan ko, hindi ako member ng LP, hindi ako member ng anumang partido ng panahon na iyon. Nagbitiw ako sa NPC. The question is not accurate in the sense of, it presumes na sinusuportahan ko na siya to begin with.

DAVILA: To balance the perspective, did Sec. Mar, then Senator Mar, even asked for your help?

FGE: He did not.

DAVILA: Mar never did in the first place.

FGE: Not that I have intended or rather not he did. You have to understand Karen na pareho ko silang kaibigan, nakasama ko si VP Binay sa kampanya ni FPJ. Nakasama ko si Sec. Roxas bilang Majority Leader noong ako ay nagsisimulang member ng Kongreso , pareho ko silang kaibigan noong panahon na iyon. At hindi para sa akin na mamili sa pagitan nilang dalawa pero yung tanong lang, it cuts both ways, hindi ba why did I dumped Sec. Roxas? Is it also fair to say that why did I dump the partner of VP Binay? Botante po ako hindi po ako member ng partido, I choose who to vote for regardless of the tandem or the parties that they are running.

DAVILA: Do you believe the 2016 Budget will be really 'pork' and DAP free?

FGE: I haven't seen it, it was submitted only yesterday to Congress. We don't have the copy yet.

DAVILA: Will you look at it?

FGE: Of course, I committed that to Senate President Drilon. Sabi ko patuloy akong lalahok para lang tiyakin na yung safeguards na inilagay namin noong 2015 ay mananatili sa 2016 Budget. Now what are these safeguards Karen? Number 1 kinopya ko verbatim ang PDAF ruling ng korte, kung ano yung sinabi nila sa pork barrel kinopya ko verbatim. Para walang duda. Walang alanganin na ito yung sinabi ng Supreme Court ito yung bawal, ngayon kung may lumalabag doon Karen, sampahan nila ng kaso pero ginawa naming konkreto yung batas kaugnay ng DAP ruling ng court, kinwestion na yun sa korte, hindi naman inisyuhan ng TRO pa hanggang ngayon ng korte yung aming probisyong ginawa which we believe is in compliance with the DAP ruling of the court.

DAVILA: So may lump sum pa rin?

FGE: Palaging magkakaroon ng lump sum Karen. Pero ang hamon, kung paano bawasan ito. Number 1, Calamity Fund will always be a lump sum. Contingency Fund will always be a lump sum, simply because we don't know what calamity hit us. We don't know what bridges will be destroyed, what buildings will be damaged, hindi naman natin alam lahat iyon. And siguro additional lump sum pa yung MOOE, palaging magiging lump sum din yun. Halimbawa, kabilang doon ay bayad ng kuryente, bayad ng gasolina, bayad ng repair ng sasakyan, bayad ng repair ng lamesa, kapag nilagay namin lahat sa budget, although may details, hindi na lang ipinalagay dun, siguro mga 50 volumes yung budget lalabas.

DAVILA: Here two questions from Twitter. Wait, let me continue this, Sec. Abad said that savings can be declared at any time but isn't that against the SC ruling?

FGE: It's not against the SC ruling, the previous budgets did not provide for it.

DAVILA: But when do they declare the savings? Sabi ng SC by the end of the year.

FGE: Hindi Karen, sabi nila kapag walang sinabi ang batas at the end of the year lang pwede. Pero kapag may sinabi ang batas kung kailan, yun ang dapat na sundin.

DAVILA: So ano daw?

FGE: So ang inilagay naming sa 2015 Budget in compliance with the DAP ruling ay ito number 1, ang savings ay natipid lamang na pera, ibig sabihin one million yung budget yung highest bid is 900,000, may natipid na 100,000 savings iyon. Hindi pwede ituring na savings ang isang project na hindi nila natuloy dahil lang nagbago ang isip nila at biglng ayaw na nila, at kung nadelay dahil kasalanan nila, hindi pa din savings iyon.

DAVILA: So what do you do with the money?

FGE: Kelangan bumalik sila sa Kongreso, babalik yung pera sa National Treasury and then they have to go to Congress again to ask Supplemental Budget. Tthat's what you put in the 2015 GAA at nakalagay pa dun na hindi ka pwede magre-align sa non-existing item sa GAA.

DAVILA: Here's one question from Twitter, tanong niya, is Senator Chiz now becoming the epitome of a political butterfly. He left NPC, he left Mar, he left ERAP and UNA and now he left LP and the very coalition who helped him in 2013. How do you feel that there are perceptions like these?

FGE: I only joined one party and that's NPC. I left only one party too, NPC. And I've been independent ever since, , I've never been a member of UNA. I've never been a member of LP. I've never been a member of President Estrada's party, I think he's confusing the positions I've taken with my party affiliation, those are two different things.

DAVILA: What about Danding Cojuangco, are you in good ties?

FGE: We are okay Karen. I visited him after he had this operation only this year.

DAVILA: Because what happened is the Inquirer came out with the NP and NPC forming the Grace-Chiz alliance and then you have that head of NP and NPC denying it, how did you take that?

FGE: Actually hindi naman sa amin galing Karen, ang nagsalita niyan ay NP at NPC members nung una at maliwanag naman din yung sinabi nila, sabi nila sa statement nila most of the members of NPC are inclined to support. It was never a party decision to begin with, there was even nothing to deny because they said nothing about the party.

DAVILA: If in case you and Senator Grace decide to run, will you have a Senate slate?

FGE: I don't know yet Karen, I'm not yet there. I don't think Senator Grace is there. We're not yet there. We're not yet there.

DAVILA: But at least you are testing already. I mean you're going around and testing the reception.

FGE: You have to understand Karen, the last day of filing is October 16 and the beginning of the campaign period would be on February.

DAVILA: Oh that's two and a half months kasi August, September, October 16.

FGE: Yung proclamation rally if ever Karen nung mga kandidato will be sometime in February. Lahat ng tao ngayon nag-iisip kung tatakbo o hindi. They're going to a process internally or externally whether or not they will run. And at the end of the day, you have sufficient time to talk to, choose from, assuming you will run, from those who have actually filed. Mahirap kasi magbuo tapos biglang last minute ay ayoko na lang, hindi na lang. Mas magandang gawin yun kung saka-sakali after everyone has filed already. At least everyone is a candidate already.

DAVILA: Before we go. Erap said when he was on the show, objectively speaking Mar is the most qualified because he says he's well educated, he was with him in Trade, I think it was DTI. Mar kept open the BPO industry, but he's not connected to the masses. Grace is being hit for lack of experience, qualifications. Do you believe someone like Grace, or can Sen. Grace already run the country?

FGE: You know Karen, those who are saying that are members of the Liberal Party. But they are contradicting themselves. When the president sat in office he was also inexperienced. And yet the LP is saying, and I would tend tobelieve that too, that he has done a lot for the country.

DAVILA: So PNoy sat in the office he was a one term, to be fair, just to remind the public. President Aquino, but Sen. Noynoy then, was a one term senator.

FGE: Like Sen. Grace, Karen. He served, he won in 2007 with me and then ran for president in 2010. Sen. Grace won in 2013.

DAVILA: But how many years was he in Congress?

FGE: Magkasabay din kami.

DAVILA: So two?

FGE: Three terms, nine years.

DAVILA: So tehere's a bit more experience.

FGE: But what I'm saying is, that was the same accusation with the president, and that was what the LP was grappling with against presidential candidate Aquino in 2010. And they defended it, if what they're saying is true. I tend to believe, that in a certain degree, that he has done a lot for the country, then they're contradicting themselves by saying or claiming that that is a (inaudible) requirement for anyone to run or serve as president.

DAVILA: But you know Sen. Grace personally, is she mentally already prepared? Emotionally prepared?

FGE: I think that's what she's determining right now. Kung handa siyang tumakbo at manilbihin kung saka-sakali.

DAVILA: Alright, here's a text. I won't mention the name last. Source: Karen, Sen. Chiz Escudero and Sen. Grace met with Migz Zubiri more than a month ago and asked him to lead their senatorial slate. Migz declined, Migz's father Joe Zubiri is for Duterte.

FGE: That's not true Karen.

DAVILA: You never met?

FGE: I met Migz, in fact I saw him in the mall the other week. Nagkita buong pamilya namin, kasama ko pamilya ko.

DAVILA: But did you ask Migz to lead your senatorial slate?

FGE: No Karen.

DAVILA: Parang I can't imagine.

FGE: Migz hasn't even decided on whether not to run. When I asked him when we met.

DAVILA: When did you meet?

FGE: Almost recently. Mga two weeks ago in a mall, sa Rockwell.

DAVILA: Yun lang?

FGE: His father and their family haven't really decided yet on what he will run for, whether for governor or senator. And it is basically updates.

DAVILA: So this is not true?

FGE: Na nagmeet kami kasama si Sen. Grace at asked him na mag-lead? No.

DAVILA: That's not true?

FGE: No.

DAVILA: On that note Sen. Chiz Escudero thank you so much. Go ahead.

FGE: Ang kasama ko lang si Heart, hindi si Grace sa mall.

DAVILA: Alright, that's Headstart today.