Transcript of Senator Risa Hontiveros' interventions during the Development Budget Coordination Committee (DBCC) briefing
August 16, 2023

Senator Risa Hontiveros (SRH:) Kahapon po yung unang araw ng DBCC briefing hindi nababahala yung economic managers sa utang, pataas na raw ng pataas ang ating credit rating at magiging madali at mura ang pangungutang sa ibang bansa. Pero sa totoo lang din, nasayang ang isang taon and naitatanong halimbawa, anong hakbang ang mga nagawa halimbawa nina SOF para umusad ang mga tax measures na hinihingi sa kanila ni Presidente.

Maitatanong din saan kaya nila kukunin ang pambayad sa ating uutangin, so Mr. Chair colleagues, yung mga tanong ko will most probably revolve around two themes. Una, at nabanggit ko na rin kahapon, na yung bansa natin and actually yung buong mundo patuloy na nasa crisis mode at patuloy na humaharap sa mga bago pang hamon at yung budget as it is expended now 2023 and even as it is proposed in 2024 di siya fit sa layunin na ito.

Pangalawang tema, ang gobyerno, actually sa tingin ko po is at risk of living beyond its means, at risk pa nga ng revenge debt accumulation sa 2024 yung mga spending programs ay naprogram sa mga revenues na interpellate din ni Sen. Koko kahapon, yung mga spending programs ay mga programmed sa revenues na maaaring dumating na too little too late.

Diretso na sa inflation at rising prices na kumpara sa mga nakaraang taon at least sa mga mamamayang Pilipino yung inflation e kahit sa mga surveys ngayon lumalabas na top of mind talaga.. So inflation nga nitong first semester ay sina-cite ng economic managers para sa kamakailan lang particularly sa 2nd quarter na slowdown sa GDP growth pero itong inflation muli is rearing its ugly head.

Ang presyo ng bigas ay tumataas dahil mahal ang imports, nasalanta tayo ng bagyo, baha; ayaw daw ibenta na ng mga Thai at Vietnamese exporters ang bigas sa mas mababang presyo na kinontrata sa kanila ng mga importers natin. Tapos may El Nino pang inaasahan. At tumataas din ang presyo ng langis. Dalawa po itong nabanggit ko kahapon. Tumataas din ang presyo ng ibang pagkain dahil hindi na naman pinapadaan ng Russia ang wheat at ibang pagkain na galing sa Ukraine.

Ang Bangko Sentral naman sa ilalim ng dating Governor Medalla ay nag-rekomenda noon ng tinatawag nilang "non-monetary"na GOCCs at line agencies ang gagawa dahil hindi na dapat tinataasan pa masyado ang interest rates bilang pang-kontra sa pagtaas ng mga presyo. At matanong din, ilang porsyento na ba ang itinaas? Magkakaroon po ba muli ng mga non-monetary measures upang pababain ang mga presyo -- ito ba'y reflected sa revenue program? Ito ba ay reflected sa budget? Non-monetary measures halimbawa, itataas ba ang importation ng corn para sa feeds? Magkakaroon ba ng fuel subsidies? Bababaan ba uli ang tariff sa pork imports? Aalisin ba ang tax sa uling na gamit ng ating power plants? Mafkakaroon po ba ng ganitong non-monetary measures, reflected po ba sa revenue program? Reflected ba sa budget mismo, Mr Chair?

NEDA Sec. Balisacan: Let me provide the broader picture, the specific budget related measures can you provide Sec. Mina, I think that we do recognize the critical importance of inflation in achieving our development goals particularly sa poverty ho and food security. Insofar as what non-monetary measures we deploy, I think the bigger picture is we must deploy appropriate deploy trade policy. As I said earlier, if we have shortages, not only small shortages, but big shortages , you must be able to access supplies from other sources from abroad if that would mean nationally we don't have enough.

I think in the early part of the COVID, initially the main source of inflation was imported because of supply disruptions globally but eventually it became increasingly domestic and that was because partly because of our then lack of appreciation of what we have there inadequate information about our local situation, the supply, demand, production, the volume, the inventory. We don't have those available immediately shared across stakeholders so stakeholders can take appropriate actions. In short, napatagal ang shortages and that led to increases in commodity prices, at least some of commodity prices. kaya napakaimportante yung trade policy, yung data na iyon ay shared and regularly collected para properly informed of the local situations.

So, so again, looking at the longer term and not that just for this year but in the for the rest of this medium-term that we have our priority, our trust is to improve productivity. ANd in the case of agriculture as I said yesterday nothing less than --

Senator Sonny Angara (SSA): How can we improve, Sec if we keep on importing?

Balisacan: No the importation should not be seen as a permanent solution --

SSA:But if you look over time we've been in Congress for quite some time, you have been with the DA since the 90s with my father pero you've seen siguro as a percentage of spending, I think it's gone up over time would you agree?

Balisacan: Yes because if you look at our data closely, our productivity has barely moved. Because compared to our neighbors like Indonesia, Vietnam in particular if you look at well China is particularly spectacular, raising from 2 to 3 metric tons to 10 tons per hectare and they done that in such a short period of time.

Senator Cynthia Villar (SCV): Just like onions, I saw the figure, every year it's 27,000 metric tons ang shortage but the importation is 100,000 e di tatamarin na ang onion farmer to produce because ang laki ng importation why don't you review the PSA data and importation? You should review that every year, it's so high. Even rice, nakakapagtaka, why ang laki-laki.

Balisacan: It's our choice, I mean --

SSA: I think we all know why we're importing a lot. I think we all know why, di ba? I mean I don't want to say it outright, I don't want to accuse anyone of illegal acts,. but I think we all know why.

SRH: Well maybe I'll say it a bit of what we all know,

SSA: We all know why, alam naman natin yan. hindi sinisikreto yan

SRH: Opo at yung susi ang salita rin ni Sec Arsi, choice. Isang synonym niyan ang political will. If the governments of other countries were able to exercise their political will na ibigay talaga yunn suporta sa mga domestic producer nila - it was an explanation for a time but it did not remain an excuse forever - what's preventing us from doing the same? Para nga talagang liliit magkakatotoo yung sinasabi nyo, na liliit over time ang share ng importation and we will be able to feed, clothe, house ourselves.

Balisacan: And if again, learning from our lessons and the lessons of many countries around us, closing the border to prevent importation is, will not --

SRH: Again, Sec. Arsi, gaya sinabi ng Chair kanina, we're not talking about protectionist measures even an extreme measure like closing our borders, it's just that pagbigay ng tamang prayoridad, suportra, empowerment sabi ni Sen. Nancy kanina sa ating domestic producers para masupplt nila yung karamihan ng ating kailangan para pandagdag lang, pampuno ng mas pakonti nang pakonti over the years na importasyon.

Balisacan: We actually agree with that. Empowerment, the power to choose. The power to choose is so important. The policy restricting trade by say, not allowing and we do have that - we have deployed that many times, enforced when we need it the most at that particular time, that is when things get crazy. But when we use other measures and build us up over the time, investing in logistics, why cant we get our logistics invested in? Our farm to market roads, but my constant plea is if I look at the this technological support of our farmers, do they have the appropriate planting materials..

SRH: Let's give those to them. Hindi rin po namin ipinagkakait sa gobyerno to use importation, as you said, in certain points in time, pag kinakailangan. Pero ano na lang siya, pampuno, pantawid lang. We really have to see the strategic and long-term policies and programs. Handa kami ibigay iyon, the chair is even talking about industrial policy para maimplementa iyon. We just have to do it, and take out the other blocks and exacerbating factors along the way including smuggling. Yung smuggling nagagamit pang excuse yung underproduction daw natin. Eh kung palakasin nga po natin yung ating productive capacity ng domestic producers. Together with the law enforcers, we will undercut the smuggling, di po ba?

DOF Secretary Ben Diokno: Let me complement what my colleague has been saying. Rather than saying that the country is in a crisis, I don't think that the Philippine economy is in a crisis. The International Monetary Fund and the World Bank admires the way we handle the Philippine economy. The credit rating agencies, despite the massive downgrades of economies all over the world, have maintained the credit rating of the economy. In fact, recently we had an upgrade in the rating.

Inflation expectations, Governors Felipe Medalla and Eli Remolona have claimed that the inflation expectation is well anchored in 2024 and 2025. So we don't have to do anything more but continue with our, we have an inter-agency Committee on inflation, that will continue. We have divided the work between food inflation and non-flood inflation. The activity of that committee will continue, and on the debt service, I have mentioned this yesterday and I will mention it today, our debt is manageable. The right metric is not the absolute level of debt. It is debt as percentage of the gross domestic product or the size of the economy.

Our debt to GDP ratio is around the neighborhood of sixty percent, that's manageable. Other countries would have, 100 to 200 percent ratio, and higher debt to GDP ratio. And the structure of our debt, is as explained by the treasurer, is also manageable. That's why at the very beginning we already devised the Medium Term Fiscal Framework. This is not our annual framework, a three year framework but rather a six year framework that will get us back before the pandemic. As you know, the pandemic affected all countries.

SRH: Appreciate ko naman and kaya po ako nagi-insist mula kahapon na may crisis situation parin and not just for the Philippines but also for other countries, but ang pinakacare natin ay ang sa Pilipinas, okay, cinecelebrate ko naman kapag tinataas yung rating ng mga rating agencies, naiintindihan ko yung debt to GDP ratio, pero the people - kung kanino tayo pinakanagbubuo ng budget - karamihan ng mga tao who are in crisis, sila mismo nagseself rate na mahirap, sila mismo ang nagseself rate na gutom. And it will take time because of the structure of the economy, na literally magtrickle down sa kanila yung mga ganitong mga epekto, average naman ang debt to GDP ratio natin o mataas man ang rating natin sa international rating agencies. Gusto ko lang panatilihin sa perspective natin na there is a crisis.

Sheltered ang mga tulad naming mga middle class, at mas sheltered yung mga mayayaman, pero yung mga karamahin ng mga mahihirap... kaya ko rin tinatanong ang mga non-monetary measures, kaya ko itatanong pa yung mga safety nets. Iba yung crisis perception ng mga pinakabulnerable sa krisis kumpara sa atin na mas protektado laban sa krisis.

I wonder if Sec. Arsi or si Sec. Mina would like to add about the non-monetary measures, kung reflected ba sa revenue program o sa budget?

Balisacan: Our approach is in response to the inflation is targeted intervention, using targeted measures like targeting our ayuda to those who are most vulnerable and so we are facilitating the completion of our PhilSys ID project so that everyone will have an ID and ayuda will be given directly to the concerned individuals. So wala nang middleman whether that is an agency or another party. That way, we can reduce substantially the budget for social protection even as we cover more beneficiaries.

As of now napakataas yung leakage sa mga ayuda natin dahil very imperfect yung delivery system, but Sec. Gatchalian is working very hard to get that system enhanced.

SRH: Sabi niyo po ba, substantially marereduce yung budget for social protections?

Balisacan: Hindi po, mag-iincrease po. What I meant is the administrative cost, the leakages, even if keep the current amount, we will reach more of the potential beneficiaries since we know the leakages and we know who those poor are, they are connected to our system.

SSA: Maybe less duplication in the receiving end.

SRH: Salamat Sec. Arsi for mentioning the targeted measures, social protection na not decreased yung budget, kahit same level pero balak ninyo by making the administration more efficient to benefit more. Mabuti kasi kung hindi madami yung non-monetary measures yung safety nets nga po yung itatanong ko. Kasi may balita nung isang araw na parang kung kelan sumasama ang panahon at ang ekonomiya, parang kontra tiyempo na nabalitaan ko yung sinabi ng Finance Secretary na nakaplanong iwind down sa mga mahihirap.

May scale-up na ba halimbawa ng food stamps program ng gubyerno, na binanggit ni Sec. Mina kahapon, sa ngayon ay para lang sa 50,000 na pamilya? O i-aadjust na ba ang allowance ng 4Ps - na binaggit din ni Sec. Mina kahapon - at itataas na ba ang sweldo ng mga manggagawa - na tilakay ni SP kanina? O aayusin na ba palalawakin crop insurance system ng bansa - na binanggit ni Sec. Mina kahapon -para ang mga nasalanta ng hangin at baha at madaling makabangon? At I-aadjust na ba ng LTFRB ang kita ng mga drivers?

DBM Sec. Mina Pangandaman: As mentioned po sa presentation we will continue po major social programs that we have po from previous years and siguro po yung sinabi din po ni Secretary Arsi Balisacan and Sec. Diokno po moving forward po baka po yun nga po para maging magfocus po better administration and implementaion sa pagbibigay ng ayuda because we know that there's a lot of leakage po in terms po of distribution ng ating ayuda at cash grants sa ating beneficiaries po.

And siguro po while we exited the pandemic some sort of nag-exit na po tayo maybe in our future budget also it's reflected quite here na po na mas dadamihan natin ang livelihood opportunities and programs na binibigay po natin sa ating mga kababayan.

In fact, when we presented the budget to the president, he noticed po that yung mga livelihood projects natin it's across all government departments and agencies po kaya po sa 2025 binigyan po kami ng direktiba ng presidente to increase yung kung pwede po yung biudget for livelihood para makapagbigay ng mas maraming trabaho sa ating mga kababayan at baka pwedeng i-centralize sa isang agency because we know that mayroon po ang DOST mayroon ang DTI, ang dami pong ahenstya na nagpoprovide ng livelihood baka mas maganda po na i-rationalize, i-steamline, ilagay lang sa isang ahensya para mas madali po ang pagbibigay ng ating mga benefits sa beneficiaries, Madam Chair, Mr Chair.

SRH: Pero Sec. Mina, imemaintain ba o even dadagdagan o babawasan yung budget para sa 4Ps sa 2024? Kasi yung tama ung naaala ko yun yung subject ng sinabi ni Sec. Diokno sa isang balita

Pangandaman: Nag Increase po sya.

Diokno: Let me clear my statement, hindi po siya immediate. Ang assumption po ng sabi ko na in the future baka pwede nating bawasan if we make the system more efficient for example, pag nabawasan natin ang leakage, only those who are deserving should get it. And mayroon na po tayong bagong proseso ngayon.

For example, if we limit it to those who have national ID kasi yan talagang identified ka national ID and imamatch po natin yan sa tinatawag nating basic deposit account pwede pong magbukas sa Landbank ng basic deposit account for everybody. Ililink po natin doon. Kasi ngayon eh, parang cash card anybody can get it, cash card, parang may duplication po, maraming leakages, isa pang assumption noon, yung sinasabi ni Sec Mina ang dami-dami hong mga nagkalat yung mga ayuda.

Sabi ni Presidente why don't you consolidate it? Mayroon ka sa DSWD. mayroon ka sa DA, mayroon ka sa DOLE, mayroon ka sa DTR, madami, mayroon sa DOST. Why not consolidate it? Yun po ang ibig sabihin na in the future, baka pwede nating bawasan yan. Lalo na kung gumana na yung employment ano natin pag marami na pong may trabaho ay mas hindi na natin kailangan ng ganung kalaki.

SRH: At yung in the future na yun, Sec given the greater efficiency in the ayuda programs given generation ng more quality jiobs and employment, ano po yung time frame ng in the future na yun na bababawasan yung sa 4Ps?

Diokno: Hindi po yung 4Ps, yung 4Ps po hindi po yun, more or less constant po yan, that's about 4.4 million.

Pangandaman: Pero yung 4Ps po kasi di ba po may conditionalities po yun, so as we move forward po -

SSA: What you are saying is pag nag graduate na pasok na ng bago -

Pangandaman: Opo na sa iba naman po siya. Sana po eventually mabawasan yung denominator natin para makita po natin yung impact ng binibigay po natin na grants sa mga kababayan natin.

SRH: And in fact, over the years every budget debates nababanggit din natin effective yung 4Ps, naggagraduate talaga yung mga pamilya, pati mga anak nila, nag-gagraduate sa mga high schools bilang valedictorians, salutatorian at marami sa kanila enrolled ngayon sa SUCs --

SSA: Even college I believe, mayroon nang cases na college graduate

SRH: Great to hear. Follow up question lang po dito, sinabi ng SWS noong June 2023 a dumami ang gutom so lalakihan po ba natin ang pondoi para sa pagtugon sa gutom?

Pangandaman: Yung sa food stamp po ba ito ng DSWD?

SRH: Pwede po opo.

Pangandaman: Kasi po as of now, they're undergoing pilot project po in different areas and then ADB is helping DSWD po to come up po with regulations natin once we implement it sa 2024. AS of now, naka peg muna siya sa 50,000 hoiuseholds but I know po sa budget natin mayroon tayong naka stand by fund po tayo in case po after the study of DSWD and ADB dumami po yung beneficiaries po for the walang gutom program.

SRH: Good to hear.

SSA: One of your slide showed bigger budget for school feeding or one of the feeding programs?

Pangandaman: Yes po major part din po kasi ng increase nung bduget doon is medyo tumaas po ang price nung milk and kaya po tumaas din po siya

SSA: You're not really feeding more?

Pangandaman: Mayroon din po pero may portion din po talaga na tumaas ang presyo.

SRH: Salamat Chair, salamat Sec. It's good to hear na kahit papaano mixed responses doon sa first couple of questions ko maybe I would have wished more on the non-monetary measures but there are some reassurance regarding yung mga safety nets kasi otherwise kung hindi pa rin gagawin itong adjustments na ito sa kita at wala ring public subsidy galing sa budget baka tanungin tayo, ano'ng sinasabi natin sa mga Pilipino no, na bahala na lang kayo sa buhay nyo. Sige po, to my second question po , follow up ko po yung ilang points na nireaise ni sen loren kahapon sa right of way acquisition funds.

A few days ago, DPWH Secretary Bonoan told the Committee on Public Works that for three consecutive years, Congress has been given very little in the way of Right of Way and resettlement budgets. As of last week daw ito na 1.7 billion lang daw ng kanilang P37 billion Right of Way and Resettlement funds ay na release. Tama po ba itong claim ni Secretary Bonoan?

SSA: Just to share while they're retrieving the answers. Sometimes the right of way kasi it says lump sum eh. If we knew the specific project it would be, we give them the money but in the past, hindi nila nagagastos so yun ang problema. It's kind of a chicken and egg if they could give us the specific, ano ang pagkakagastusan nung right of way then we can allot it. As Sec, all of us in the room know that if your utilization is low, you will lose that money. Ganoon lang yun eh.

SRH: Actually, swak dun sa last request po this noon if the DBCC could provide the finance committee a report of the right of way acquisition funds na nasa 2023 NEP and over the years, ito po ba ay nareduce sa NEP? Tapos in the --

SSA: Well I can answer that. We really reduced it. Because we looked at utilization in the previous years eh. Pag hindi nga nagagastos just like DoTr, DPWG, pag mababa ang utilization, then we will use it where the funds can be used more efficiently.

SRH: I agree Mr Chair, but would the DBCC report to our Committee -

SSA: But nonetheless can you comply with the request of vice chair Hontiveros as well as may request din yata si Senator Loren and si Senator Imee for information just to remind.

Pangandaman: We will submit po and then siguro po just to follow po yung sinabi ng ating Chair though we try to provide a bigger project just like in 2023 na nabawasan po siya sa GAA but it's still substantial, it's 1.6 billion but to date po, hindi pa po nagagastos much of the amounts, 0 obligations pa po siya as of now. Siguro kasi po pag right of way, kailangan may perfected contract, nakausap ang lahat ng --

SSA: Kaya nga maybe we haven't really sorted out di ba may batas na diyan sa right of way law that there's certain preconditions before you can allot funds and senator ping i remember would stand up and remind DPWH, pag hihingi kayo ng pindo samin dapat alam namin saan pupunta yung pondo. I think he stood up on at least three consecutive budgets if I remember.

Pangandaman: And if I remember din po Mr Chair parang ngayon lang po kami rin naglalabas ng action documents doon sa mga right of way. Middle of the year na po usually halos ngayon lang po naglalabas ng action documents, SARO, para sa right of way

SRH: So ayun po if the DBCC could provide that to the committee nareduce ba sa NEP, sa course ng GAA approval, o hindi lang ba narirelease ng DBM yung nasa budget.