Press Release
October 12, 2022

Transcript: Phone patch interview of Senate President Juan Miguel "Migz" Zubiri

QUESTION: ON THE BLACKLISTING OF THE PHILIPPINES

SP ZUBIRI: I will try to put this on record. The word blacklist, hindi galling sa mga senador yan. Binanggit po ng ambassador ng China yan, galling kay Amb. Huang. I clarified it even with Sen. Gatchalian, na kasama ko po sa meeting, and several other staff, siya ang nagbanggit about blacklisting. Ngayon, siguro lost in translation kami kung yung blacklisting ay present tense or future tense. Siguro ang appreciation ko noon was we were blacklisted, but baka ang gusto niyang sabihin, na ang gusto niyang sabihin sa atin, na ang blacklist ay for future tense na posibleng ma-blacklist tayo. But, I stand by my statement na he mentioned the word blacklisting. Hindi galing sa amin yan ha? Galing po sa ambassador ng China yung salitang blacklisting kaya nabahala po kami ni Sen. Gatchalian tungkol diyan.

QUESTION: PERO HOW DOES IT FEEL? SABI KASI KAHAPON NG EMBASSY IT IS A BIG MISINFORMATION.

SP ZUBIRI: Well, we stand by our statement, we have a transcript of what has transpired.

QUESTION: SORRY, NABREAK LANG YUNG SABI NA HINDI GALING SA SENATORS, YUNG SA KANILA GALING, COULD BE LOST IN TRANSLATION. THE EMBASSY CALLED THAT AS A FORM OF MISINFORMATION. YOU ACCEPT THAT?

SP ZUBIRI: Well, the fault lies with the ambassador. He mentioned blacklisting, so siguro, nagkamali yung ambassador. Pero we stand by our statement na binanngit po ng ambassador ang word blacklisting several times. Ito nga, kausap ko si Sen. Sherwin Gatchalian kanina, ang text nga niya sa akin, ito... "baka lost in translation bro, pero narinig ko rin ang blacklisting." Sabi ni Sen. Gatchalian yan. "Pero clarify as ok na yun, consistent naman tayo that we heard the word blacklisting." So, the word blacklisting comes from the Embassy of China, from the ambassador. Maybe he made a mistake, maybe his statement was about future tense, we could be possibly blacklisted. Naalarma kami doon because finollow-up ko sa kanya, I said "ambassador, how many tourists did we have in 2019, pre-pandemic?" Siya ang sumagot, sabi niya we had two million tourists sa Philippines pre-pandemic and so it will be a waste kung hindi nga sila makakapunta sa Pilipinas and he mentioned nga today its only 22,000 tourists so far for 2022. So, napaka clear ano, ang statement niya that we could be possibly, baka ang ibig niyang sabihin, we could be possibly blacklisted for hosting POGO activities. But he also mentioned in this discussion, sabi niya sa amin, sa mga senador na kasama ko doon, na may mga bansa na na diniscourage na nila pumunta ang mga kababayang Chinese, lkatulad ng Cambodia at Myanmar. Binanggit po niya yun, hindi po kami nananaginip. Yan ay katotohanan, marami po kaming witness at pinatranscribe po sa Protocol office yung mga binanggit niya. Nandiyan din yung head of Protocol, si Dir. Toboy De Guzman, nandiyan din yung Chief-of-Staff ko...

QUESTION: AFTER PONG MAGLABAS NG CLARIFICATION ANG EMBASSY, WALA PA PONG COMMUNICATION SA INYO?

SP ZUBIRI: Well, nagtetext po sila sa aking staff pero humingi naman ng -- you know, I asked for permission. Humingi po ako ng permiso kay Ambassador. Very clear 'yon, alam po ni Sen. Gatchalian 'yon. Sabi ko sa kanila, "Pwede ko bang banggitin 'yong pinag-usapan natin ngayong araw na ito sa hearing ni Sen. Gatchalian?" At huminigi pa nga ako sa kanila na maghanda po sila ng resource person at baka tawagan sila ng committee para magsalita tungkol dito sa issue na ito. Pumayag naman 'yong Ambassador. Pumayag si Ambassador Huang.

Kaya kinabukasan, nagbigay ako statement and verbatim sa mga binanggit ni Ambassador Huang that a possible issue between our two countries on the hosting of POGO. Hindi po iyon executive session, pumayag siya na magsalita ako tungkol sa binanggit niya, sa aming dalawa, sa aming tatlo ni Sen. Padilla at Sen. Gatchalian.

Again, I find it regrettable that they quoted it as a misinformation that the word "blacklist", and you can interview all those who are there, including the head of Protocol of the Senate, and say that the word "blacklist" was used.

QUESTION: PERO SIR, DURING YOUR CONVERSATION, HINDI NIYO NA-CLARIFY KUNG CATEGORICALLY, OFFICIALLY, KASAMA NA ANG PILIPINAS SA KANILANG BINABLACKLIST? HINDI NIYO PO NA-CLARIFY 'YON?

SP ZUBIRI: Hindi ko na-clarify 'yon. On my part hindi ko na-clarfiy.

QUESTION: SIR, GOOD MORNING, SI PAOLO PO ITO. SIR, BUT WHY DO YOU THINK THEY ARE ACTING THAT WAY NOW? KASI APART SA NABASA NAMIN SA NEWS IN OTHER COUNTRIES ABOUT THE SAME ISSUE, THERE ARE POGOS, PARANG ANG GUSTO PA RIN NG CHINESE GOVERNMENT, NG BEIJING, TO HAVE HIS BLACKLISTING --

SP ZUBIRI: Actually, Paolo, totoo 'yan. Kung magre-research po kayo online, maraming statement na ang iba't ibang Chinese embassies all over the world that overtly stated that they would blacklist countries hosting POGOs. It is official online. Now, hindi ko alam kung ano ang posisyon ng ating embahada, Chinese embassy dito sa Pilipinas, siguro gusto lang po nila ng kaunting diplomasya. I think they're trying to be very diplomatic and careful with their words. So they're now correcting and clarifying the statement of the ambassador with the statement that he made last Monday dito sa Senado.

QUESTION: THERE WERE ISSUES ON THE VARYING INTERPRETATIONS ON HOW THE WORD "BLACKLIST" WAS USED, BUT WILL THIS -- HOW DO YOU SAY THIS -- SOMEHOW AFFECT THE ONGOING COMITTEE HEARINGS OR THE JUDGEMENT OF THE MEMBERS OF THE COMMITTEE OR THE SENATE? JUST TO ADD TO THAT. WILL YOU TALK TO MALACANANG OR THE PRESIDENT ON THIS REGARD?

SP ZUBIRI: Well, Paolo, I'm going to, either way, write the Ambassador or will message the Ambassador to get a categorical statement about the blacklisting of countries that host POGO activities. Kasi 'pag sinabi niyang, "Yes, posibleng ma-blacklist ang bansa ninyo," posible, ha, that is the operative word, ay medyo mabigat po 'yan dahil ayaw po nating mawalan ng Chinese tourists dito sa ating bansa na gusto talagang makakita ng ating mga napakagandang tanawin dito sa Pilipinas. Now that would weigh a lot on our decision, because we might lose 2 [million] to posibly 5 million tourists in the future every year.

So yes, after the committee hearings of Sen. Gatchalian, we'll weigh the pros and cons. And we'll approach the President, lalapitan po natin si Pangulong Marcos at ipapakita po natin 'yong findings ng report para makahingi po tayo ng konting guidance sa kanya kung ano po ang polisiya ng gobyerno, nitong bagong gobyerno, on the issue of POGO.

QUESTION: SIR, KA-CLARIFY LANG NAMIN, PWEDE? 'YONG SINABI NIYO NA TINEXT NG EMBASSY 'YONG STAFF NIYO, THIS WAS AFTER YOU MADE THE STATEMENT ABOUT BLACKLISTING?

SP ZUBIRI: It's after -- yeah, my staff is right in front of me -- it was after.

QUESTION: WHAT WERE THEY TELLING THE STAFF, SIR? ANO 'YONG SINASABI NILA, SIR?

SP ZUBIRI: "Hi...I sent you a statement on POGO-related issues by the spokesperson of the Chinese Embassy." So iyon din, pinadala nila 'yong message na iyon na pinalabas sa media.

QUESTION: YOU SAID NO NEED TO APOLOGIZE FROM END, SIR, 'NO?

SP ZUBIRI: My end? Why will I apologize? I stand by what he said. He said it to us, I'm just the bearer of the message. Ano lang po ako, messenger lang po ako sa mga binaggit po ni Ambassador.

But, he corrected it, he clarified it, so we accept his clarification, but we put on record that he mentioned the words blacklist and blacklisting. Hindi ko lang po alam kung sinabi niya 'yon present tense or future tense, kung posible bang ma-blacklist or na-blacklist na tayo. Iyan din siguro ang kakulangan po namin, sana po ay we clarified if we were already blacklisted. But the message was clear about the blacklisting of countries that host POGOs

QUESTION: SIR, WALA PA KAYONG COMMUNICATIONS AFTER MAG-CLARIFY 'YONG EMBASSY?

SP ZUBIRI: Wala. I guess I'll leave it that, kasi, that's a foreign, that's a sovereign country, as embassies are offices of a sovereign country. And I hope they will also respect the Senate as an institution of this country. Ang atin lang dyan , we stand by his statements na sinabi nga niya 'yong black list at blacklisting.

So mahalaga na malaman ng taong bayan, hindi kami nambobola, hindi po kami nananaginip, binaggit po niya 'yon, siya na po mag-clarify kung maba-blacklist po tayo kung itutuloy po natin ang POGO sa ating bansa. I think that's what they should clarify.

QUESTION: YOU METIONED PO FROM 2 MILLION BUMABA NA SA 20,000 YUNG CHINESE TOURISTS DITO SA PILIPNAS, SO HINDI PO BA PARANG MAROON NANG DISCOURAGEMENT YUGN CHINESE GOVERNMENT SA MGA CHINESE TOURISTS PERO WALA LANG OFFICIAL BLACKLIST, GANUNP BA ANG NANGYAYARI SIR?

SP ZUBIRI: Maybe you should ask the embassy why from 2 million in 2019 naging 22,000 na lang po tayo ngayon for 2022 ang katanungan dyan po ay nasa embahada ng Tsina so I wouldn't know why. But that is a large number from 2 million nagging one percent na lang po ang pumapasok sa ating bansa.

QUESTION: SIR CLARIFY LANG NAMIN KASE BOARDING KA NA. YUNG PINADALA SA IYO NA STATEMENT ITO BA YUNG MAY WORD NA MISINFORMATION OR YUGN EARLIER STATEMENT NILA NA?

SP ZUBIRI: Sisilipin ko ulit guys ah.

QUESTION: SP WALA BA SILANG NABABANGIT DIYAN NA YUNG BLACKLISTING AY DISINFORMATION? YUGN YUNG PINAKALATEST KASE NA...

SP ZUBIRI: (INAUDIBLE) It says here to (INAUDIBLE) tourists are important component of practical cooperation.... If you notice that statement, if you notice that statement guys they don't say anything about POGO vis-à-vis blacklisting. So ang maganda tanong sa embassy ng China it I have a chance or opportunity to talk to the ambassador, I will tell him Ambassador, what is your categorical statement about countries hosting POGO operation, will they be blacklisted or will you discourage tourists from coming here? Yan ang magandang tanong sa kanya, dahil hindi po niya binaggit dyam sa kanyang statement.

QUESTION: ARE YOU SLIGHTED? ARE YOU OFFENDED BY THE LATE...

SP ZUBIRI: I was shocked by the turn around. I was shocked by the statement of the embassy and its regrettable because we have several witnesses eh. That best way of saying is maybe mali po ang pagsabi ng misinformation i think it should have just been a clarification. Kase clarification would mean clarify would mean clarify what the ambassador said. But misinformation lumalabas na para akong 'marites' na nagbibigay maling information or yung tinatawag na fake news. Weh hindi naman fake news yun eh ang daming nakakarinig sa kanya buti sana kung kaming dalawa lang ang problema ang daming witness dalawa pang ibang senador. Tatlo kaming senador na nakikinig sa kwento niya.

QUESTION: WLA NAMAN PONG INTENSION SP NA YUGN NGA, MAG KAROON G MISINFORAMTION ON YOUR PART?

SP ZUBIRI: Yeah, I think the word misinformation is the wrong word to use. I believe an explanation, or a further explanation on the statement of the ambassador would have been a better word to use. But definitely hindi fake news iyan and I standby what I said and all those you can interview, Dir. Toboy, he is upstairs on the 6th floor. You can interview my chief-of-staff she's on the 6th floor and you can interview the two other senators who will confirm the word blacklist and blacklisting was used several times by the ambassador.

QUESTION: HINDI NAKAKA-OFFEND YUN NA KAYO YUNG SENATE PRESIDENT KAYO PA YUGN NAG CLA-CLARIFY NGAYON, THE WORD BLACKLIST EVEN CAME FROM HIM TAPOS MISINFORMATION PA YUNG GINAWA NYO DAW?

SP ZUBIRI: Well, alam ninyo naman yung mga embassies and ambassadors they are very careful with the words that they use. Siguro yung kwentuhan namin nung Monday was more of a free flowing of ideas and candor maybe hindi yan totally officially the position of the Chinese government. So ako naman in the end of the meeting guys, I asked permission if I can share the information and he said yes I can share the information to the committee so, I did.

QUESTION: DO YOU THINK THEY OWE YOU AN APOLOGY? BECAUSE THE WORD CONSIDERING NA MAY CLEARANCE KAYO YOU TALKED TO AMBASSADOR, YOU HAVE THE TRANSCRIPT AND THEN THEY USE THE TERM MISINFORMATION AND YOU ARE THE SENATE PRESIDENT...

SP ZUBIRI: Yes. As again I like to put on record it is regrettable that they use the word misinformation. We are not the spreaders of fake news here maraming witness sa binanggit ng ambassador at tatlong senador at maraming senate staff including senate protocol ay nandoon. Meron po kaming transcript of records so napaka clear na binangit po niya yun. I think the better word is to clarify the position of the ambassador vis-à-vis the position of the Chinese government.

QUESTION: SHOULD THE EMBASSY APOLOGIZE TO YOU?

SP ZUBIRI: Hindi na. Okay na. bahala na sila. That's a foreign country, so I am happy with my clarification and I just want to put on record that it is regrettable. Pero apology not needed. We don't need to have a diplomatic row on this particular issue.

QUESTION: PWEDE PO BA KAMI MAKAHINGI NG TRANSCRIPT THAT YOU WERE REFERRING TO?

SP ZUBIRI: I will have my staff send you guys.... Actually you can just mention kase pangit naman baka may privilege information dyan.

QUESTION: YUNG PORTION LANG ABOUT THE BLACKLISTING?

SP ZUBIRI: Yes. Yes. We will prepare. I will have Dave Torres the head of my legis send you the copy because nung paglabas po nila ng statement nay an talagang tinawagan ko lahat ng staffs ko. Tinawagan ko si Sen. (Win) Gatchalian at tinanong ko sa kanila, mali ba pandinig ko? May hearing problem? Hindi, talagang yan ang mensahe niya sa atin nugn nandun tayo sa 6th floor function room. So it was very clear and that is why I say it's regrettable...

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