Transcript of Interpellation
Senator Risa Hontiveros During the CHED Budget Deliberation
November 17, 2022

Senator Risa Hontiveros (SRH): Last August 2022, I filed a resolution requesting an investigation into some anomalies in relation to the implementation of UNIFAST. Ako po kasi ay lubos na naalarma sa mga nakukuha kong kwento sa mga estudyante on the late or non-release of their tution fees, na tila nakumpirma ng COA report.

The Association of Higher Education Institutions in Region XII, President Dr. Agapito Lubaton, approached our office and forwarded their complaint against CHED for delayed release of TES payments covering 2nd semester SY 2020-21 (old grantees) and 1st and 2nd semester SY 2020-21 (new grantees). What is strange is that they were told by DBM last year that the budget for TES payments were already released to their CHEDRO XII. Pero wala pa din daw sila natatanggap as of today. 90% po ng estudyante nila ay mga IP. This jibes with more than 400 complaints that we have received from students all over the country that their tution fees were released late or not at all.

The Chairperson previously flagged to the Senate Committee on finance that around 226,000 qualified students may be deprived of tertiary education because of the budget cut for 2023\. I do support additional funding to ensure that our young people have access to tertiary education, but I need to be sure these funds are used judiciously. Moving forward, anong mga bagong measures ang in place para siguruhin na maiwasan ito?

Senator Pia Cayetao (SPC): Mr. President, it was in the middle of September when DBM downloaded the funds to CHED and they then immediately they released it immediately to the regional CHED offices which then proceeded to release it to the schools and then from the schools they have to give to the students, one thing we can possibly do your honor is talk to DBM because I asked the chairman this was also the case in the previous years, so it seems fair enough based on my understanding that between September and the present it's already in the schools. If we can get additional feedback cause at least we know that from the time it went to regional offices and the schools, umandar ng mabilis. I would be happy to make representations with DBM to release the funds sooner.

SRH: Salamat, at salamat din sa binanggit ni Madam Chair that this is not the first time this has happened, nangyari na rin po ito nung nakaraang mga taon, and this jibes with our data in my office that the complaints there are complaints that even since 2019 to 2020 until yesterday morning had still not received. So 3 school years running already hindi pa nacheck na ng CHED sa mga regional offices nila na huwag maulit yung nangyari in the 2 previous school years to recur this year baka po para sa isang commission yung 3 years running is not yet cause for alarm, pero para sa mga estudyante na umaasa hindi lang taon taon pero seme-semestre umaasa sa ganitong financial support eh pangatlong beses na silang naaalarma why the repeat non-performance?

SPC: The particular school that her Honor is referring to received on September 28 of this year, 2 weeks after the funds were downloaded to CHED the amount of 21,846,300 so natanggap naman but all of us agree that this causes so many anxiety on the part of the students mahirap na ngang magaalala kung papasa ka, kung you have materials to study, and then yung tuition mo pa inaalala mo, so we recognize that and this representation personally will take this up with the secretary of DBM.

SRH: Thank you very much, however yung cinite po ng CHED ay isa sa higit sa 400 na reklamo na natanggap so far ng opisina ko mula nga nitong school year 2019-2020, three years ago hanggang sa kahapon ng umaga tungkol sa current school year 2021-2022. Napansin po nga po sa COA report so bakit hindi pa mula sa unang school year na covered at least nitong 400 complaints malay po natin may antecedent complaints to these 3 school years we are talking about bakit hindi pa kaagad na inaksyunan at iniwasan ng CHED para hindi na rin paulit ulit na pansinin ng COA o hindi pansinin ng COA over several fiscal years as they overlap with the school years?

SPC: CHED submits the list and the requests for the funding in July and one of the requirements of DBM includes the complete details in the list and I can only surmise that they verified the list in some way, in any case it is a new administration, and I have had very successful discussions with the secretary on various issues, so like I said this representation is happy to find out and discuss with the secretary the difficulties we end up imposing on the students no because of these delays your Honor.

SRH: Indeed, Madam Chair is correct bagong administrasyon ito, so bukod sa it's taking 3 years for corrective action to be taken, tumiwad na po mula sa dating administrasyon hanggang sa bagong administrasyon, what new measures will be put in place, to make sure that repeat performances of this situation of the students will be avoided? At saka para siguruhin Madam Chair na yung hindi pa rin natanggap ng mga estudyanteng nakaranas ng ganito ng nakaraang administrasyon ay kanilang matanggap na ngayong bagong administrasyon? At hindi na maulit yung ganitong karanasan?

SPC: Just to be clear, when it's not an election year, they are able to request it around April and they would get the funding a few months later, so it is particularly delayed every 3 years on election year.

SRH: So yung school years 2019 to 2020 at 2020-2021 so in fact natanggap yung pondo at nadownload ito nung June nakukuha. SPC: June after election ban and then can they request for it.

SRH: So noong dalawang unang school years na iyon, na pinag-uusapan natin, the funds were actually available at least 2 months earlier and yet many of these 400 complaints are accounted for in those school years. Nagkaroon lang ng dahilan or pagdadahilan or a recurrence of these complaints, these experiences itong school year...

...

SRH: During the budget committee hearings, I flagged the issue of ghost scholars as our office received numerous reports of HEIs allegedly listing ghost scholar applicants and submitting the same to CHED for the Tertiary Education Subsidy (TES) scholarship program. Has CHED received similar reports?

SPC: My staff has worked with CHED on this so I will read the response and may I just get a confirmation from CHED if ito pa rin yon. According to CHED they are not aware of any alleged ghost scholars, if the same refers to the so-called double scholarship grants to 338 students in Region 2 and 5 the issue has been looked into by the concerned regional office and 123 students from the 27 HEIs have already returned the double payment while the 215 students are in the process of settlement.

SRH: Unfortunately it's not the same issue, yung issue po ng double scholarships in some regions ay isa sa mga COA observations pero ito pong issue ng ghost scholars ay iba pa po. Kaya wala po bang natanggap na ganun mga ulat ang CHED.

SPC: Other than what I reported your Honor they don't have any, so if Her Honor has something please share it with them, please investigate it immediately.

SRH: Madam Chair, CHED even motu proprio can already start investigating that.

SPC: But there has to be a lead your honor, if you just say ghost scholarship, medyo walang ka anu ano naman yun, kung saan nanggaling iyon, sabi ko nga saang region, para meron silang mauumpisahan and what they know of that they though might be related sabi niyo po ay they are not related so we need more information to give them to work on it because I will also push them to work on it your Honor.

SRH: In fact I was about to say na makikipagtulungan sila sa amin at lalo na Madam Chair na considering na dito isyung ito sa ghost scholars hindi naman CHED directly ang sinisisi ng mga nagrereklamo, kundi mas yung mga HEIs ang nirereklamo and therefore it is also in the interest of the commission to ensure that those HEIs are compliant. So yes no problem na makipagtulungan, and I hope that that same attitude will be forthcoming from the CHED.

SPC: Yes, in fact they already have a task force to investigate so if there is a representative from her Honor's office or from whoever sent the complaints, they are very happy to proceed.

SRH: Thank you and also for mentioning the taskforce because until this early morning, hindi pa naman ever nagreach out sa amin ang task force so but hopefully, moving forward we'll be able to address this issue as well as the earlier unifast issue we talked about for the sake of the students and for the sake of the higher education institutions themselves, both the HEIs and the scholars.

I'm just surprised na hindi pa rin nakatanggap ng ganitong mga ulat ang CHED considering na hindi lang pala itong representation ang nakarinig nitong isyu or nakatanggap ng reklamo tungkol sa isyung ito but Madam Chair earlier mentioned she has also worked with CHED on this issue.

And lastly for the budget of CHED, there are also stakeholders who approached us regarding HEIs misusing or mismanaging the funds which led to students not receiving benefits such as tuition fees and other allowances. Aware po ba ang CHED dito? Mayroon po ba silang ongoing investigation sa usaping ito at ilan nang mga HEIs ang napenalize ng commission?

SPC: Yes, the chairman says they are very familiar with these cases, there's quite a few sadly, for the benefit of all, what happens is there's a total amount of 60,000 given and then they're only supposed to keep a certain amount representing tuition and miscellaneous, and give the rest. So ang mangyayaring kaso ay tinatago lahat, konti lang ang ibibigay. May mga ganon, they have investigated and they have already settled quite a few, in fact, I went further and said, "eh kung sadya na yun, deliberate yan, hindi yan mistake, minority floor leader, estafa yun di ba that's withholding funds that are in your safekeeping, fiduciary safekeeping. They are aware and they will be vigilant about this.

SRH:At may ongoing investigations pa po ba?

SPC: Oo, tuluy-tuloy, yes.

SRH: Salamat at ilan nang HEIs ang napenalize ng CHED?

SPC: They can even give us the list of schools that they are investigating, but again, i'm going to say to all of you what I have said to the chairman, kung mayroon nang intent to commit fraud that should already be a crime, your honor.

SRH:At dahil may kalikasan na yan ng isang krimen, mayroon na po bang napenalize na HEIs, at ilan po?

SPC: They have cases when they've already addressed the situation na pinabalik yung pera may mga ganon na sila, but I'm going further in telling them that they should check with their legal and see if there are criminal if they prosecute these schools if may malice na yun.

SRH: So wala pa pong napenalize?

SPC:Magpahiram daw tayo ng mga abogado sa kanila, kulang daw sila ng abogado, majority floor leader. Tatlo lang ang lawyer nila but can you farm that out? You can farm that out di ba?

SRH:Is this representation to understand na sa isyu ng misuse or mismanagement ng funds by HEIs na ang resulta ay hindi natatanggap ng estudyante ang benefits nila tulad ng tuition fees at iba pang allowances, zero pa ang HEIs ang napenalize ng CHED?

SPC: They have resolved the issues. They have ordered the HEI to pay but I'm the one, this representation is the one going further in telling Ched na you have to check because if there was malice if it was an honest mistake, you may have pursue this by way of filing prosecuting so sinasabi ko lang yun sa kanila and if so, they may have to hire additional lawyers, kasi yung processing yun ng claims, you don't need naman lawyers for that you just need baka accountant nga to see kung saan napunta and to make a determination but if they'll go further and file cases then of course, they need lawyers for that.

SRH: I agree, Mr President, I agree also with Madam Chair dun sa pag-udyok nila sa Ched to take stronger action but just for the record, ibig pong sabihin wala pa pong na-penalize?

SPC: When you say penalize, then you mean criminal action?

SRH:Yes madam chair

SPC: Wala pa.

SRH: Zero pa.

SPC: Pero pinasettle na nila, yun mayroon.

SRH: Salamat, dako na po ako dun sa European Maritime Safety Agency o EMSA kaugnay ng CHED, just several factual questions.

During its last audit, the European Maritime Safety Agency or EMSA flagged a number of so-called shortcomings and grievances vis-a-vis the education and training of our seafarers. The Ched as provided under the higher education act of 1994, RA 7722 formulates and implements academic policies and standards for maritime education takes the lead on education and training and shall ensure that all maritime schools or institutions or training centers maintain and or continuously upgrade the quality and standards of education and training. This includes the design and implementation of the following courses administered by the Commission on Higher Education ("CHED"): Bachelor of Science in Marine Engineering ("BSMarE"), and Bachelor of Science in Marine Transportation ("BSMT"). Is this correct Madame Sponsor?

SPC: That is correct, you Honor.

SRH: Maraming salamat po Madam Chair Now, among others, the EMSA found that the relevant authorities in the Philippines which, I presume includes the CHED, did not ensure that the maritime education and training in our country was structured in accordance with written programs, and included the methods and media of delivery, procedures, and course materials necessary to achieve the prescribed standards of competence required by the International Convention on Standards of Training, Certification and Watchkeeping for Seafarers ("STCW Convention").

The EMSA also stated that the CHED and the Maritime Industry Authority ("MARINA") did not sufficiently ensure that all training and assessment activities carried out by Maritime Education and Training ("MET") Institutions, and Maritime Higher Education Institutions ("MHEIs"), were administered, conducted, monitored, evaluated, and supervise, as required by the STCW Convention.

Just a few baseline questions, Madam Chair, - ilan po bang Maritime Higher Education Institutions and Accredited Assessment Centers ang meron tayo sa ngayon? At ilang graduates and pinoproduce natin taon-taon.

SPC: There are 83 schools under the jurisdiction of CHED. The other which are training centers are under MARINA, so wala yang kinalaman sa CHED.

SRH: Salamat, Mr. President, Madam Chair. Nahati nga yung jurisdiction kahit sa maritime education and training sa pagitan nitong dalawang institution. At ilang graduates po ang pinoproduce?

SPC: Would your honor like to ask another question while they are checking? It is a specific number so they have to check.

SRH: Alright Madam Chair though nagugulat ako na hindi at the tips of their fingers itong datos na yan.

SPC: Well there are hundreds of schools so let us give them a few minutes.

SRH: Certainly, alright Madam Chair. Sabi nga po nila kanina, hiwalay pa yung training centers under MARINA, yan din sana yung itatanong ko kanina, how many public maritime training centers does the government maintain? Pero meron po ba pareho itong yung mga HEIs under CHED and yung training centers under MARINA, meron ba silang simulators na required ng STCW convention? Kung wala, sa tingin ba ng CHED ay dapat magpondo?

SPC: Actually lahat sila meron, your Honor. Isasara nila kapag wala.

SRH: That is good to hear, Madam Chair, pero nakakagulat din dahil may mga anecdotal inputs na either maritime HEIs or training centers, lalo na yung wala sa coastal areas, nasa landlocked areas, na walang simulators. But it is good kung lahat pala ayon sa CHED ay meron. At naanticipate na rin ni Madam Chair yung susunod kong tanong na ano ang mangyayari sa maritime training centers na hindi magcocomply sa requirements.

SPC: Yes, and they have closed in the past and siguro nga kaya nga nagcomply na yung iba, they closed 15 schools, maritime programs.

SRH: Yung 15 na isinara ay maritime HEIs or training centers o pareho?

SPC: Wala silang jurisdiction sa training centers so maritime programs.

SRH: Salamat Mr. President, Madam Chair. So nung sinara nila yung 15 maritime programs na iyon, nagpatuloy pa ba yung HEIs, yung maritime HEIs? Para madistinguish nito lamang ng representation na ito what is the difference between closing a maritime HEI and closing a maritime program.

SPC: There are schools which have other programs, for example, customs administration. So hindi affected yun. Not the whole school that will close, it is just the program that will close. So tuloy tuloy naman yung school na yun for other programs.

SRH: Understood Madam Chair. Moving forward, paano po inintend ni CHED na iaddress yung key findings ng audit report, at least on how they relate to maritime education and training? Ilan ba yung mga programa at specialized na programa na kailangan ievaluate?

SPC: CHED intends to do the following: 1) Attend to the development and issuance of revised policies, standards and guidelines - this is otherwise the curriculum - for implementation of maritime HEIs starting this school year, 2022-2023, 2) Revise the PSG� focuses on outcomes-based education and hence concerns like assessment, examination and assessment of competence were already addressed.

As to the non-compliance of maritime HEIs, CHED has reduced the number of maritime HEIs from 128 to 83. This is over the span of - parang the lifetime of my daughter - from 1994 to 2022. CHED has closed an additional - ito yung sinasabi ko - 15 maritime programs as of 2022. CHED has imposed a five year moratorium on the opening of new maritime programs and it is attending to the development of standardized course packages. Upon the instruction of the President, CHED will work with DOTr, DOLE and DMW to implement more reforms to comply with all of the EMSA observations.

SRH: Maraming salamat Mr. President, Madam Chair. Interesting yung isa sa gagawin nila na moving forward, impose a five year moratorium. Even if briefly, bakit "five year" moratorium? At bakit five years, hindi mas maikli or mas matagal?

SPC: The five years, your Honor, will give CHED enough time to review the existing schools without having to deal with the opening of new ones. Because most likely those will be the same schools, somehow guised under different entities or different owners that will reapply. So the five years give them time to review the existing schools.

SRH: Thank you Madam Chair. Doon sa binanggit ni Madam Chair na standardized course packages, ito ba yung tutugon sa audit report na MARINA and CHED had not yet completed the design of the "programs of study" for the BSMT and the BSMarE programs?

SPC: Yes. That is exactly to address that.

SRH: Alright. Salamat Madam Chair. And I presume pati yung "the curriculum mapping for the BSMT program did not include knowledge, understanding and proficiency items ("KUPs") for two (2) out of the fourteen (14) competences specified by the STCW Convention." So tumbok din ito doon?

SPC: Yes your Honor.

SRH: Maraming salamat Madam Chair. Pwede po bang malaman saan sa budget items ng CHED nakapaloob ang trabaho nyo o mandate ng Commission sa STCW Convention? Magkano ang ginagastos natin para dito at bakit hindi parin natutugunan ang issue at problema sa qualifications and standards required by the EMSA? Over 16 years na daw nila tayo inauudit at binabalaan tungkol sa mga audit findings?

SPC: What was that question, the first one is saan yan nakapaloob and the answer is under operations, and the follow up to that was?

SRH: Magkano ang ginagastos natin diyan sa budget items na iyon at bakit hindi parin natutugunan 16 years since we started receiving those audit reports?

SPC: So the line item is "development of standards of excellence for higher education programs and institutions." And the amount under the 2023 GAA, the 2023 committee report has been increased as compared to last year, it is now P95.78 million. But that is not just maritime, but it falls under that.

As to bakit hindi natin natugunan since considering 2006 pa nagbibigay ng observations. Actually your Honor, the number of compliance issued, the number of observations were 126 and there has been a lot of changes made in these compliances. So the number of observations was 126 and with the compliances, this has been reduced to 23. So in fairness, close to a hundred observations have been addressed, and continuing yan, kaya may bagong news na meron paring observations. But it is not new, and these are ongoing changes that they are making.

SRH: Maraming salamat Madam Chair. Well indeed quantitatively significant no, parang 80 percent ng mga observations ay natugunan na, may natitira na halos dalawang dosena.

But qualitatively, I am just guessing kasi hindi ko maidentify sa ngayon yung 23, baka ito ay napakaimportante kaya umabot tayo sa lumabas sa balita na napipintong posibleng hanggang mag-expire na lang yung certificates of competencies ng ating mga seafarers, ng ating mga marino at kung hindi pa maresolve yung kabuuan ng audit report ay hindi na sila maiissuehan ng COC, at hindi na sila makakasampa muli.

So it's good to know the progress made so far but really the hopes of all the seafarers and yung pamilya nila and the country are on probably resolving these remaining 23 observations.

So far my last question, on this early morning, ano po yung current timeline sa pagresolba ng lahat ng mga issue moving forward, para we do better, or we do well on the next audit? Yung five year moratorium, yan na rin po ba yung timeline natin? Kelan ba yung next audit? Will it fall within the next five years, kung yan nga yung timeline?

SPC: Well CHED will have to be guided by the timeline and any other steps moving forward to address this problem by this team that the President instructed them to put together. I repeat, these are CHED, DOTr, DOLE and DMW. So they can report to us in due time on what their plans are, and what the timeline is.

To also add, your Honor, those observations when I was asking, every year nagiimprove ba, actually everytime when a team of examiners come they have new different observations, so it is like a moving target.

SRH: Madam Chair, that is an unfortunate situation, alam ko may iba't-ibang intepretasyon na maari nating maibigay sa ganoong sitwasyon, pero the fact of the matter is habang nandoon tayo sa laot ng may mga unresolved observations, posibleng target tayo, speaking of moving targets, ng additional observations.

Kaya nga we really need to bring this ship into port, sa pamamagitan ng team na yan ng CHED, DOTr, DOLE and DMW para may safe berth na siya, masiguro na yung half a million FIlipino seafarers na sumasampa sa EU-flagged ships ay mayroon na silang kasiguruhan sa pagtatrabaho.

I understand na yung team po, itatakda pa nila yung kanilang timeline, they may not go as far the five year moratorium na inimpose ng CHED in order to review all the maritime programs and HEIs pero kailan po ba yung susunod na audit at aabot po ba yung findings and observation, and actions and recommendations ng team?

SPC: So after the observations were made, their responses to the observations were submitted, and if the responses were adequate, they will be hopefully getting a recertification next year. So anything we do is just to further enhance and improve the systems, kasi tapos na yung audit.

SRH: I see, Madam Chair. Ika nga sa literature, "a consummation devoutly to be wished." So I suppose the whole Senate will also join ang ating mga marino in the hope and the prayer na yung recertification na iyan ay matanggap na sa susunod na taon.

These are all my questions in this early morning, Madam Chair, Mr. President, maraming salamat po.

SPC: Thank you very much, Senate Deputy Minority Leader Risa Hontiveros.